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  #21  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:34 AM
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SF is an armada, but not the UFP...
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  #22  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:35 AM
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And Orion Slave Milk!
Well we know where mammals produce milk...
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  #23  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:38 AM
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Well we know where mammals produce milk...
In a factory?
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  #24  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:48 AM
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SF is an armada, but not the UFP...
They are not separate entities - they are linked therefore their seemingly opposite intentions are not that far removed from each other.
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  #25  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:52 AM
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The Federation is the government, Starfleet is the military, exploration service of said government.
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  #26  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:53 AM
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I think since the Romulan/Earth War had already happened that creating a better defensive/offensive capability and making sure their ships had weapons would be a foregone conclusion anyway, even outwith the Kelvin incident.
Yeah, but the Earth-Romulan war was almost a century ago. But now the Narada was on a whole other level. This gigantic, seemingly-invincible ship, apparently of Romulan origin, had appeared out of nowhere.

The Romulan Government might have denied any involvement --which probably was the cause of the Federation having such intimate familiarity with Romulans (appearance, language, etc] before when 'Balance of Terror' would take place-- but it would still be cause for precaution on Starfleet's count.

Much in the same way they revved up the defense and science research to prepare for the Borg in TNG, big advancements would likewise end up being made in anticipation of possible war with Romulus... again. Which would subsequently serve to explain to why the Sexyprise and her fellow modern starships are bigger, bolder, and more powerful (and, surprise surprise, looking different inside and out!) than their 'prime' counterparts. The technology being utilized is probably already on the level of the TMP-era, and more defense-oriented.

See, it all fits together!
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  #27  
Old 10-01-2009, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaboom View Post
Yeah, but the Earth-Romulan war was almost a century ago. But now the Narada was on a whole other level. This gigantic, seemingly-invincible ship, apparently of Romulan origin, had appeared out of nowhere.

The Romulan Government might have denied any involvement --which probably was the cause of the Federation having such intimate familiarity with Romulans (appearance, language, etc] before when 'Balance of Terror' would take place-- but it would still be cause for precaution on Starfleet's count.

Much in the same way they revved up the defense and science research to prepare for the Borg in TNG, big advancements would likewise end up being made in anticipation of possible war with Romulus... again. Which would subsequently serve to explain to why the Sexyprise and her fellow modern starships are bigger, bolder, and more powerful (and, surprise surprise, looking different inside and out!) than their 'prime' counterparts. The technology being utilized is probably already on the level of the TMP-era.

See, it all fits together!
Except there's absolutely no indication of heightened Federation/Romulan tensions anywhere in the film. And since 25 years had passed, you'd think relations would have altered even if they were at one point higher. Especially when no War arrived.

In fact, Nero goes out of his way to say that he 'stands apart' from the Empire in his actions.
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  #28  
Old 10-01-2009, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaboom View Post
Yeah, but the Earth-Romulan war was almost a century ago. But now the Narada was on a whole other level. This gigantic, seemingly-invincible ship, apparently of Romulan origin, had appeared out of nowhere.

The Romulan Government might have denied any involvement --which probably was the cause of the Federation having such intimate familiarity with Romulans (appearance, language, etc] before when 'Balance of Terror' would take place-- but it would still be cause for precaution on Starfleet's count.

Much in the same way they revved up the defense and science research to prepare for the Borg in TNG, big advancements would likewise end up being made in anticipation of possible war with Romulus... again. Which would subsequently serve to explain to why the Sexyprise and her fellow modern starships are bigger, bolder, and more powerful (and, surprise surprise, looking different inside and out!) than their 'prime' counterparts. The technology being utilized is probably already on the level of the TMP-era, and more defense-oriented.

See, it all fits together!
You forget the Kelvin which looks different and bigger than Prime Universe ships. Not that I care about everything fitting together and making sense, but (just like in any Trek before) there is no in-universe explanation for the different design.
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  #29  
Old 10-01-2009, 11:10 AM
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Except there's absolutely no indication of heightened Federation/Romulan tensions anywhere in the film. And since 25 years had passed, you'd think relations would have altered even if they were at one point higher. Especially when no War arrived.

In fact, Nero goes out of his way to say that he 'stands apart' from the Empire in his actions.
Well, he says that 20-something years later. Besides, that line was in response to "Christopher" suggesting getting the Romulan government involved, so 'the Feds' must have still thought the Empire was behind him in some capacity.

Either way, the advancements already had been made or set into motion one way or another. J.J. did actually say that data gathered and relayed by the Kelvin pushed things along that way. Trying to be "on the safe side" against Romulan attack seems as good a reason as any.

But you are right about there being no evident tension. If anything, I think it might have been one-sided. Like Starfleet is freaking out, trying to prepare, while the Empire is just all, "lol, you crazy."

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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
You forget the Kelvin which looks different and bigger than Prime Universe ships. Not that I care about everything fitting together and making sense, but (just like in any Trek before) there is no in-universe explanation for the different design.
Yeah, I don't care that much either. I'm chalking the size issues up to a 'style' choice rather than something requiring or meriting any in-universe explanation. ILM's 'shipwrights' had the Kelvin and other ships scaled smaller to begin with, but were told to bump up the size for dramatic effect. Not their fault, not worth worrying about or counting against things.

Besides, in almost every other aspect, the Kelvin looks like a pre-TOS era ship. "Good enough," I'd say.

Last edited by Kaboom : 10-01-2009 at 11:16 AM.
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  #30  
Old 10-01-2009, 11:25 AM
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Also, in the end, "armada" is just another word for "fleet." It may have some military implications behind it, true.
Words meant to hide somethings true meaning... like calling an ICBM the 'Peacekeeper'. A political distinction only meant to sugar coat something specifically designed to cause massive death and destruction when called upon to do so. Old story, Trek included, and it depends on whether or not you buy into the spin both in the story and more appropriately of the writers.
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