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Old 09-15-2009, 11:37 PM
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Default Sequel: allegory, modern-day issues, torture?...

http://trekmovie.com/2009/09/15/abra...-day-allegory/
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The first movie was so concerned with just setting up the characters — their meeting each and galvanizing that family — that in many ways a sequel will have a very different mission. it needs to do what [the late 'Trek' creator Gene] Roddenberry did so well, which is allegory. It needs to tell a story that has connection to what is familiar and what is relevant. It also needs to tell it in a spectacular way that hides the machinery and in a primarily entertaining and hopefully moving story.
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one of the things we heard was, ‘Make sure the next one deals with modern-day issues.’ We’re trying to keep it as up-to-date and as reflective of what’s going on today as possible. So that’s one thing, to make it reflect the things that we are all dealing with today.
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I asked Orci somewhat flippantly if that meant we might see Starfleet grappling with the ethics of torture or dealing with a rising terrorist threat or perhaps a painful, politicized war with the Klingons.
"Well yeah, those are the kind of issues we’re talking about. Wow, you’re good! But seriously that’s the way we’re thinking, that’s an approach."
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Old 09-16-2009, 12:23 AM
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Now that we know that, here's my idea...
It is very simple. The loss of Vulcan = the loss of the WTC.
2258 Romulus will be attacked by the Federation, even though they don’t know anything about it. The theme is: revenge at all costs, even against innocent people? Kirk & crew rebel against the Federation and try to prevent the war against Romulus.
That’s my current dream about Trek Sequel.
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Old 09-16-2009, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCC-73515 View Post
Now that we know that, here's my idea...
It is very simple. The loss of Vulcan = the loss of the WTC.
2258 Romulus will be attacked by the Federation, even though they don’t know anything about it. The theme is: revenge at all costs, even against innocent people? Kirk & crew rebel against the Federation and try to prevent the war against Romulus.
That’s my current dream about Trek Sequel.
The whole 9/11 storytelling trope is a bit ***ked out in film and TV and literature right now.

I'd rather they try for a broader theme instead of something glaringly obvious.

I do think that the story could encorporate Vulcan though.
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Old 09-16-2009, 03:36 AM
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9/11 already was reflected in ENT and thousands of movies etc. a lot.

Maybe they should try to come up with a financial crisis allegory instead.


But whatever allegory they think of, I am very grateful they want to make a relevant Star Trek movie again. STXI was as good as a blockbuster-prequel could become, but a little more is always welcome.
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Old 09-16-2009, 03:50 AM
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Then perhaps the more recent war crimes?
Or LGBT rights?
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Old 09-16-2009, 03:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Kukalaka View Post
I'd rather they try for a broader theme instead of something glaringly obvious.
TUC was a pretty blunt allegory, yet worked perfectly well.
I don't care what theme they choose, as long as it is something that matters. Another brainless blockbuster would kill Trek.
Perhaps the writers should take a look at all those superhero movies of the last decade, just to realize that you can make an exciting movie which deals with moral issues.
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Old 09-16-2009, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by TheTrekkie View Post
9/11 already was reflected in ENT and thousands of movies etc. a lot.

Maybe they should try to come up with a financial crisis allegory instead.
I've always thought the economics of the Federation were interesting. Their assumed post-scarcity thanks to replicators is really just a shift in currency, from money that can be exchanged for anything, to the Joule to power replicators. Fortunately, they gather so much energy from renewable sources that they can claim to be post-scarcity, but I suspect that if everyone turned on their replicator at once... boom! Economic crisis.
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Old 09-16-2009, 07:03 AM
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An allgory film would be cool, and in the tradition of TOS.
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Old 09-16-2009, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Thascales View Post
I've always thought the economics of the Federation were interesting. Their assumed post-scarcity thanks to replicators is really just a shift in currency, from money that can be exchanged for anything, to the Joule to power replicators. Fortunately, they gather so much energy from renewable sources that they can claim to be post-scarcity, but I suspect that if everyone turned on their replicator at once... boom! Economic crisis.
A financial crisis allegory musn't include economy at all costs. I am not sure if Orci & Co are able to create a Star Trek movie about economy without becoming boring.
However they could use character traits like greed, the corruption of power or the search for more power as dominating movie topic and thus create an allegory to our financial crisis, maybe also include something about the consequences when additionally there are not regulations to set them at rest.

Of course they also could show us the path of the currency based economy, that I think still existed in the TOS universe, to the post-capitalistic society we know from TNG. But I am not sure if anyone else than economists could like such a movie.
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Old 09-16-2009, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by NCC-73515 View Post
Now see that's in line with what I've mused over before. An origin story must revolve around the introduction and establishment of the characters and settings.

Even TOS didn't get into the allegory stuff until a few straightforward episodes had passed to get viewers into the premise of the show.

Then
they began to drop them in.

The first film was an establishing of the environment and players. It didn't need a grand theme or powerful morality play, it's getting the basics out the way.

I'm very encouraged the writers acknowledge this and are aware they now have a duty to step up and deepen the new universe they have created with the first film.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCC-73515 View Post
Now that we know that, here's my idea...
It is very simple. The loss of Vulcan = the loss of the WTC.
2258 Romulus will be attacked by the Federation, even though they don’t know anything about it. The theme is: revenge at all costs, even against innocent people? Kirk & crew rebel against the Federation and try to prevent the war against Romulus.
That’s my current dream about Trek Sequel.
OK, merely asking, but what would drive the Federation to pre-emptively attack Romulus instead of working with them to ensure when the nova goes off in a Century the planet can be protected?

And, since (per Countdown) the Vulcans have a great deal of responsibility for all that happened, why would the Federation act so outright hypocritically?

While the writers acknowledged prior that the loss of Vulcan was an oblique 9/11 style shakeup in the new Star Trek universe, unless we're really going down the road of what happened afterwards it's an idea that doesn't seem likely on the part of the Federation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTrekkie View Post
A financial crisis allegory musn't include economy at all costs. I am not sure if Orci & Co are able to create a Star Trek movie about economy without becoming boring.
However they could use character traits like greed, the corruption of power or the search for more power as dominating movie topic and thus create an allegory to our financial crisis, maybe also include something about the consequences when additionally there are not regulations to set them at rest.

Of course they also could show us the path of the currency based economy, that I think still existed in the TOS universe, to the post-capitalistic society we know from TNG. But I am not sure if anyone else than economists could like such a movie.
Since the exact nature of the Federation's economy is one of the great unspecified's of Star Trek, O&K would have to actually explain how it all worked before using it as an allegory in a sequel.

Plus the 'absolute power' thing is as old as the hills.

No real excitement in getting fed it again.
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