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Old 05-16-2009, 05:19 PM
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Default NuTrek is Great! + debunking "plot Holes"

Nutrek is plain awesome! (i just saw it again for the 4th time) and every time i see things i missed before..

ok.. on to debunking.. those that have "issues" bring'em on ;-) ...

heres a few i have heard so far....

.1) Wait.. Kirk was born in iowa....

Kirk WAS born in iowa....just not THIS time.. the first romulan attack put his mother into early labor.. (the time inbetween attacks when the captain went over to the narada..)

2.) If Mr scott can get us to warp factor 4...

Ok.. this one should have been elaborated on a BIT more.. BUT when the enterprise arrives at vulcan.. the Left nacelle is HEAVILY damaged by the destroyed ships hull... (not to mention whatever damage they took from the attack)

There are Many more.. but i am being invited to go see it again... so in the mean time.. BRING EM on... lets get crackin... ( i will be back l8tr to dismantle any issues you might have...)
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:03 PM
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What I want to know is how Scotty gets to be chief engineer of the Enterprise.

I mean, c'mon. He's some random exiled transporter tech out on Delta Vega, and later in the afternoon he's taken over engineering? How much could he know? I'm pretty sure there had to be at least ONE guy already aboard who'd be better-qualified to run the engineering section.
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:18 PM
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I think I can help with this one.

Remember, Scotty has been in Starfleet for sometime, he's just been reassigned to Delta Vega for "losing Admiral Archers beagle". He has probally served on board other Starships Engineering Sections, and from the discussion he has with Kirk, he is already familiar with the Enterprise, and said he would "love to get his hands on those ample nacelles".
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Glacial View Post
What I want to know is how Scotty gets to be chief engineer of the Enterprise.

I mean, c'mon. He's some random exiled transporter tech out on Delta Vega, and later in the afternoon he's taken over engineering? How much could he know? I'm pretty sure there had to be at least ONE guy already aboard who'd be better-qualified to run the engineering section.
The ship was full of cadets, the main fleet was otherwise engaged. Also the equation Spock prime have him was his just not yet, I am sure he recalls it and will use it. That alone is HUGE! Cool thread, it has a positive tone.
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Old 05-16-2009, 09:15 PM
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Oh, gee...I didn't even think that the Kirk born in Iowa thing was a plot hole. Though, your explanation falls short because the timelines didn't diverge until Nero's ship appeared and, from all we can see, that looks to be just about when Mommy Kirk was transitioning in preparation to push....no time to get back to Iowa.

However, Kirk being born in space isn't a problem for me because when we hear Kirk say he was born in Iowa he's trying to convince a woman he's trustworthy and normal when she's saying "you're from outer space, right?"...so, saying "no, I was only born and work there" would sort of be self defeating. As he was raised in Iowa, telling her he was born in Iowa is just a little white fib that means nothing in the grand scheme of things.

Plot holes....

Well, no one (including the comments here) has explained how Scotty gets to be Chief Engineer. Heck, Scotty's been waiting and serving dutifully almost alone on the ice planet for months and when Spock Prime and Kirk appear he just tosses all that aside, leaves his post (and his little friend). Why did Scotty have to even go? Wasn't the idea to get Kirk back to the ship?

Scotty ejected the warp core to get away from the singularity...so, how many hundreds of years would it take to get back to Earth? I mean, to be safe, wouldn't Spock have tried to lure the Romulans very, very far away from any inhabited planet? What with the plan including the formation of a huge sucking black hole and all.... it should take a really long time at impulse power to get home, huh?

How did Spock Prime and Scotty's little friend get back to earth?

Just how high up was that drilling platform? I mean, Chekov took a really long time in "falling to earth" time to get to the transporter room.


And, why is Chekov so good at transporting? And, if he's so good, why do they give the job to Scotty later?

Why does everyone feel comfortable leaving 17 year old Chekov in command during stressful times? Pike and Spock both do it...Once, after Pike does it, Chekov runs out and leaves who? in command? Someone...we hear him say "you take the conn" but I haven't figured out who...(I'm seeing it again tomorrow, maybe I'll get it then). I mean, isn't this like Picard and Riker leaving during a battle and saying "Oh, Wes...you take command, okay?".

Couldn't Spock Prime predict the time it would take the supernova to reach Romulus? How could that be "unthinkable"?

I'm sure there are loads more, these are just the ones that jump up. But, I love the movie. Huge gaping plot holes are part of Star Trek's charm. You either buy into them or you don't. If you don't, well...I'm sure there's a hard science fiction club meeting to discuss a book or something somewhere....
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:19 PM
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originally posted by :Elizadolots..Oh, gee...I didn't even think that the Kirk born in Iowa thing was a plot hole. Though, your explanation falls short because the timelines didn't diverge until Nero's ship appeared and, from all we can see, that looks to be just about when Mommy Kirk was transitioning in preparation to push....no time to get back to Iowa.

**Nope, seen it five times now..(twice just today...) and the first time it shows her is AFTER the first romulan attack... AFTER the captain goes aboard the narada and is killed...I am fairly certain..(having been through several pregnancies with my wife..that a few torpedoes slamming into a ship could bring on early labor.. ***

However, Kirk being born in space isn't a problem for me because when we hear Kirk say he was born in Iowa he's trying to convince a woman he's trustworthy and normal when she's saying "you're from outer space, right?"...so, saying "no, I was only born and work there" would sort of be self defeating. As he was raised in Iowa, telling her he was born in Iowa is just a little white fib that means nothing in the grand scheme of things.

Plot holes....

Well, no one (including the comments here) has explained how Scotty gets to be Chief Engineer. Heck, Scotty's been waiting and serving dutifully almost alone on the ice planet for months and when Spock Prime and Kirk appear he just tosses all that aside, leaves his post (and his little friend). Why did Scotty have to even go? Wasn't the idea to get Kirk back to the ship?

**Scotty does not become "chief" engineer until after kirk becomes "captain" and at that point it is his "perogative" also it never stated what happened to the existing chief engineer....and scotty was waiting for relief (which was way overdue..prolly one of the ships destroyed in the vulcan slaughter..) **

Scotty ejected the warp core to get away from the singularity...so, how many hundreds of years would it take to get back to Earth? I mean, to be safe, wouldn't Spock have tried to lure the Romulans very, very far away from any inhabited planet? What with the plan including the formation of a huge sucking black hole and all.... it should take a really long time at impulse power to get home, huh?

**Whelp apparantly in this iteration the core contains several dilithium chambers... ... but also there is nothing wrong with the rest of starfleet.. who could (and obviously did) dispatch some ships to tow it back to earth.. **



How did Spock Prime and Scotty's little friend get back to earth?

**Prolly picked up by a starfleet ship.. there are more than one..

Just how high up was that drilling platform? I mean, Chekov took a really long time in "falling to earth" time to get to the transporter room.

***Really high.. long enough for him to get there... lol..


And, why is Chekov so good at transporting? And, if he's so good, why do they give the job to Scotty later?

***checkov is a 17 year old genius prodigy and IS good.. but scotty has more experience....and is also a big brainpan..

Why does everyone feel comfortable leaving 17 year old Chekov in command during stressful times? Pike and Spock both do it...Once, after Pike does it, Chekov runs out and leaves who? in command? Someone...we hear him say "you take the conn" but I haven't figured out who...(I'm seeing it again tomorrow, maybe I'll get it then). I mean, isn't this like Picard and Riker leaving during a battle and saying "Oh, Wes...you take command, okay?".

*****actually wes did take the con a couple of times.. and this was a less than ideal situation..

Couldn't Spock Prime predict the time it would take the supernova to reach Romulus? How could that be "unthinkable"?

** the prediction was not the problem.. the drilling of the red matter and getting back in time was...plus this was not a normal supernova.... or as "q" would say.." easy.. obviously the result of a large interspacial celestial body moving through the area through different planes of existence.. lol

I'm sure there are loads more, these are just the ones that jump up. But, I love the movie. Huge gaping plot holes are part of Star Trek's charm. You either buy into them or you don't. If you don't, well...I'm sure there's a hard science fiction club meeting to discuss a book or something somewhere....



*****Need More** ;-)
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Oh, gee...I didn't even think that the Kirk born in Iowa thing was a plot hole. Though, your explanation falls short because the timelines didn't diverge until Nero's ship appeared and, from all we can see, that looks to be just about when Mommy Kirk was transitioning in preparation to push....no time to get back to Iowa.
The appearance of the blackhole as it being the medium of transport was the start I think. To think that the blackhole randomly formed next to the Kelvin is a little silly. Its more likely the Kelvin was the nearest ship and was rerouted to investigate. The opening indicates communication with Starfleet Command had been going on for a while. Long enough for the Kelvin to complete a good scan, send it back it be checked and a reply sent Kelvim. That alone could have been the difference from being born on Earth and in space, with stress inducing early labor reducing the time needed.



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Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Plot holes....

Well, no one (including the comments here) has explained how Scotty gets to be Chief Engineer. Heck, Scotty's been waiting and serving dutifully almost alone on the ice planet for months and when Spock Prime and Kirk appear he just tosses all that aside, leaves his post (and his little friend). Why did Scotty have to even go? Wasn't the idea to get Kirk back to the ship?
Would you beam onto a ship alone where the captain had marooned you on an ice world? Might as well stun yourself as you appear with your own phaser.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Scotty ejected the warp core to get away from the singularity...so, how many hundreds of years would it take to get back to Earth? I mean, to be safe, wouldn't Spock have tried to lure the Romulans very, very far away from any inhabited planet? What with the plan including the formation of a huge sucking black hole and all.... it should take a really long time at impulse power to get home, huh?
You assume that we saw all events between the ending ceremony and the fun destruction of Narada. We don't know how much time really passed either. Is it hard to imagine that starfleet sent any ship near by to help Enterprise get underway? I wouldn't send just one ship to deal with a ship that killed a planet. By the time any help arrived all that was needed was help rebuilding the core.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
How did Spock Prime and Scotty's little friend get back to earth?
A ship took them? The whole series is about them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Just how high up was that drilling platform? I mean, Chekov took a really long time in "falling to earth" time to get to the transporter room.
Well I did a little research and as we in the 21st century define a high dive it can take between 45-60 seconds. Consider much higher would take a little longer.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...4175821AA9sb3U


Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
And, why is Chekov so good at transporting? And, if he's so good, why do they give the job to Scotty later?
You need your bridge crew on the bridge during combat. Also I can imagine after who he wasn't able to save, he wanted to be away from the transporter room. (I am trying not to give away anything that hasn't already been mentioned.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Why does everyone feel comfortable leaving 17 year old Chekov in command during stressful times? Pike and Spock both do it...Once, after Pike does it, Chekov runs out and leaves who? in command? Someone...we hear him say "you take the conn" but I haven't figured out who...(I'm seeing it again tomorrow, maybe I'll get it then). I mean, isn't this like Picard and Riker leaving during a battle and saying "Oh, Wes...you take command, okay?".
Well most people on the ship are cadets and 17 or not he has earned his place in Starfleet. Making your analogy more fitting its like having a ship of Wes's. Who do you pick, but another cadet Wes in the analogy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
Couldn't Spock Prime predict the time it would take the supernova to reach Romulus? How could that be "unthinkable"?
The sticky part was predicting the time the Nova would hit the planet. It seems that the Super Nova was close to Romulus. This one is hard to work out. Other than its a plot device like angry whale probes and 20th century wrathful probes. Huh! Probes seem to be very angry, abandonment issues maybe?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizadolots View Post
I'm sure there are loads more, these are just the ones that jump up. But, I love the movie. Huge gaping plot holes are part of Star Trek's charm. You either buy into them or you don't. If you don't, well...I'm sure there's a hard science fiction club meeting to discuss a book or something somewhere....
I agree the movie was so awesome! The reboot didn't hit reset which is far better than other series's have had. In addition it was great!
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Glacial View Post
What I want to know is how Scotty gets to be chief engineer of the Enterprise.

I mean, c'mon. He's some random exiled transporter tech out on Delta Vega, and later in the afternoon he's taken over engineering? How much could he know? I'm pretty sure there had to be at least ONE guy already aboard who'd be better-qualified to run the engineering section.
you also have to remember that half of Star Fleet's ships have been destroyed by Nero in his attack on Vulcan so you have less to choose from...plus the crew of the Enterprise are meant to be the best in their field, it's their natural ability not their experience that ultimately clinched it. And they just saved earth, so earth owes them one!
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Old 05-17-2009, 01:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spock View Post
Nutrek is plain awesome! (i just saw it again for the 4th time) and every time i see things i missed before..

ok.. on to debunking.. those that have "issues" bring'em on ;-) ...

heres a few i have heard so far....

.1) Wait.. Kirk was born in iowa....

Kirk WAS born in iowa....just not THIS time.. the first romulan attack put his mother into early labor.. (the time inbetween attacks when the captain went over to the narada..)

2.) If Mr scott can get us to warp factor 4...

Ok.. this one should have been elaborated on a BIT more.. BUT when the enterprise arrives at vulcan.. the right nacelle is HEAVILY damaged by the destroyed ships hull... (not to mention whatever damage they took from the attack)

There are Many more.. but i am being invited to go see it again... so in the mean time.. BRING EM on... lets get crackin... ( i will be back l8tr to dismantle any issues you might have...)
Well I thought the Warp 4 thing was clear from the outset, I never did get why people were confused on that one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacial View Post
What I want to know is how Scotty gets to be chief engineer of the Enterprise.

I mean, c'mon. He's some random exiled transporter tech out on Delta Vega, and later in the afternoon he's taken over engineering? How much could he know? I'm pretty sure there had to be at least ONE guy already aboard who'd be better-qualified to run the engineering section.
It's the same process that allows Kirk to take the Captaincy - the writers typed it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarTrekXIfan View Post
you also have to remember that half of Star Fleet's ships have been destroyed by Nero in his attack on Vulcan so you have less to choose from...plus the crew of the Enterprise are meant to be the best in their field, it's their natural ability not their experience that ultimately clinched it. And they just saved earth, so earth owes them one!
Come again? Half of Starfleet? They only had 14 ships all in? What about the bulk of the fleet being in the Laurentian system?
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:00 AM
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Come again? Half of Starfleet? They only had 14 ships all in? What about the bulk of the fleet being in the Laurentian system?
I exaggerated for effect! But my point was Star Fleet suffered a blow by Nero, I'm sure many good officers died on those ships.
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