[horatio]

I have gone over this already several times and don't wanna be a pain in the a*s, but one time again shouldn't hurt.

Nero is the Romulan Khan (should have become obvious when he cried "Spock, Spock!"), Khan 3.0 who is similar in too many way with Khan 2.0 aka Shinzon. Not only because he is bald but because he wants to blow up Earth and because he only makes sense if you think around the corner (why does he hate Spock who tried to help him - mistrust for Vulcans ... like Shinzon: why does he hate humans - considers himself as a Reman, hates himself or his human side which made him weak in the mines of Remus).

Romulans are evil guys with tattoos and scars now. Villains who twirl their mustaches ...

As a teenager three things have influences me most: my parents, an incredibly well-read friend from whom I learned a lot about politics and literature and last but not least, Star Trek. I don't wanna imagine what impact if any pew-pew NuTrek has upon kids today.

But enough about the loss of the Trek spirit, I stop b*tching now.

[Zardoz]

Originally Posted by horatio

I have gone over this already several times and don't wanna be a pain in the a*s, but one time again shouldn't hurt.

Nero is the Romulan Khan (should have become obvious when he cried "Spock, Spock!"), Khan 3.0 who is similar in too many way with Khan 2.0 aka Shinzon. Not only because he is bald but because he wants to blow up Earth and because he only makes sense if you think around the corner (why does he hate Spock who tried to help him - mistrust for Vulcans ... like Shinzon: why does he hate humans - considers himself as a Reman, hates himself or his human side which made him weak in the mines of Remus).

Romulans are evil guys with tattoos and scars now. Villains who twirl their mustaches ...

As a teenager three things have influences me most: my parents, an incredibly well-read friend from whom I learned a lot about politics and literature and last but not least, Star Trek. I don't wanna imagine what impact if any pew-pew NuTrek has upon kids today.

But enough about the loss of the Trek spirit, I stop b*tching now.

Your not b**chin'. Ok, I grant the Shinzon connection, that makes sense. But I do not see the Khan one. Nero did not act like Khan, in my opinion.

NuTrek is it's own, that's how I take it. Like a brand new show/movie/story.

[horatio]

Originally Posted by Zardoz

Your not b**chin'. Ok, I grant the Shinzon connection, that makes sense. But I do not see the Khan one. Nero did not act like Khan, in my opinion.

NuTrek is it's own, that's how I take it. Like a brand new show/movie/story.

Say that again after you watched the DVD and heard him cry "Spock! Spock!".

Pure Khan 3.0 and the very idea that the writers even consider Khan for the next movie makes me seriously wonder whether they think that we are dumb.
They already quasi-used Khan in this movie ... and now they believe that they can do it again and suck-out the success of TWOK until doomsday comes?

[Zardoz]

Originally Posted by horatio

Say that again after you watched the DVD and heard him cry "Spock! Spock!".

Pure Khan 3.0 and the very idea that the writers even consider Khan for the next movie makes me seriously wonder whether they think that we are dumb.
They already quasi-used Khan in this movie ... and now they believe that they can do it again and suck-out the success of TWOK until doomsday comes?

Fair enough, when I finally get my DVD, I'll check it.

I think the "Khan discussion" was just BS Paramount "leaked", or just a fleeting thought by the writers, that fans ran with.

I'd love to see an un-insane Matt Decker in the next film. Even if it's just quick communication.

[horatio]

That's a sweet idea and there are plenty of TOS characters and aliens they could use in general if they wanna use or refer to old material.

[Zardoz]

Originally Posted by horatio

That's a sweet idea and there are plenty of TOS characters and aliens they could use in general if they wanna use or refer to old material.

As background, most would work.

[horatio]

I wouldn't mind such a scene (OK, that's really uber-fanwank ).

CHEKOV: Kewin, what are you doing on the bridge, my shift is not ower yet.
RILEY: Have no fear, O'Riley's here!

[DigitalLonestarX]

I think the scene where sulu screwed up the warp entry with the interial dampener.....


his look was priceless

and it almost looked like captain pike was trying to hold a straught face

probably laughing on the inside.

[Zardoz]

Originally Posted by DigitalLonestarX

I think the scene where sulu screwed up the warp entry with the interial dampener.....


his look was priceless

and it almost looked like captain pike was trying to hold a straught face

probably laughing on the inside.

Definately!

[kevin]

Originally Posted by Captain Tom Coughlin

I don't think Nemesis had the same emotional punch that the opening to XI had.

The only emotional punch it had was disgust......that it got made the way it did.

Originally Posted by shpock

/STAR TREK understatement of the century

True.

Originally Posted by horatio

The similarities are rather in other areas: messed up Romulans, villain who wants to blow up Earth but makes no sense apart from the fact that he is super-mega-evil, TWOK-rip.

And it still works better than Nemesis did.

Originally Posted by horatio

I have gone over this already several times and don't wanna be a pain in the a*s, but one time again shouldn't hurt.

Nero is the Romulan Khan (should have become obvious when he cried "Spock, Spock!"), Khan 3.0 who is similar in too many way with Khan 2.0 aka Shinzon. Not only because he is bald but because he wants to blow up Earth and because he only makes sense if you think around the corner (why does he hate Spock who tried to help him - mistrust for Vulcans ... like Shinzon: why does he hate humans - considers himself as a Reman, hates himself or his human side which made him weak in the mines of Remus).

Romulans are evil guys with tattoos and scars now. Villains who twirl their mustaches ...

Yep, Nero and Shinzon are too heavily shaded by the memory of Khan and have problems in their writing to stand on their own.

I personally find this more fatal for Shinzon, because in part he's played by a not great actor, but also because Shinzon has more screen time, and thus more opportunity to espouse his viewpoint.

Yet still doesn't really do so.

Nero also benefits (slightly) from being more tied into the same thematic elements that linked Khan to Kirk. A mistake from the past coming back to wreak revenge upon the person he (likely incorrectly, just the same as Khan) blames for the loss.

The Nero writing is poorer and the background weaker of course, but then often Star Trek villains get saddled with, shall we say, 'iffy' dialogue. It sometimes depends on what the actor in question does with said lines.

As to the Romulans, we've been around that bush and the upshot is we totally disagree on the interpretation of Romulans, so no point going back round that one again.

Originally Posted by Zardoz

Fair enough, when I finally get my DVD, I'll check it.

I think the "Khan discussion" was just BS Paramount "leaked", or just a fleeting thought by the writers, that fans ran with.

I'd love to see an un-insane Matt Decker in the next film. Even if it's just quick communication.

I think that, at present, and indeed in the lead up to the film's release they were acknowledging that in the wake of the new timeline there are now a lot of elements which they can pull from to form the basis of future films.

Obviously, (because most Trek interviewers go for the obvious questions), someone would have gone 'Khan?' with a geek-out glint in his eye and they would have gone 'possibly', so as not to shatter the poor schmuck.

I think it would be very unlikely for them to try and redo something so immediately known as Khan.

Which is not to say they won't - I just don't expect it.