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Old 05-09-2009, 07:03 PM
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Default Hey look it's Shinzon's twin brother Nero *Spoilers*

I don't know about anyone else but I for one thought that Nero had about as much character development as a dead fish and about as much depth as a sheet of paper, I only began to appericate him as a character after I read the comic book which actually explained his motivations and showed his progression from simple ore miner to psychotic madman..(BTW i recommend Countdown to all purists, it makes the new Trek film much easier to swallow and is very well put together. But the point is I should not need to READ supplemental material to appreciate a villain half the things in countdown SHOULD have been in the new film,

but all we get is...Im angry because my planet blew up and raargh i'm going to kill things. Even Shinzon...the worst trek villain of them all,(in my opinion) was more fleshed out than Nero. In fact all I could think of when watching the film was how the two were almost the same villain, and asking myself why oh why someone would make the same mistake twice when it clearly did not work the first time.

Let's compare shall we?

Shinzon



Nero



Both are dashing bald men who come from the Romulan empire but do not consider themselves part of it. Both blame the destruction of their lives on famous federation persons, (Picard and Spock) respectively both seek to avenge themselves by constructing giant space ship monstrosities that wield some kind of doomsday device.

The Scimitar



The Narada



Both wear creepy black clothing and both are determined to kill the person who destroyed their sense of self and blow his planet up.

DejaVu for anyone else?

Nero in my opinion is the weakest villain in any Star Trek film, largely because they cut a lot of his development from the film. In the trailer we saw him breaking out of a Klingon prison.... where was that scene...we were told that he would be wonderful and a strong character...so much potential wasted so much that SHOULD have been in the film shoved into a graphic novel instead...anyone else feel this way?

anyone care to defend Nero?
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Old 05-09-2009, 07:20 PM
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Your argument is pretty compelling. Perhaps the Directors Cut of Star Trek will flesh out Nero in a satisfying manner? I do agree that if not for Countdown Nero is a pretty weak one dimensional villain. It is amazing what a wonderful job the comics did, it made things really simple for Eric Bana.
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:26 AM
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Yeah they are both Romulan bad guys with little character development and big ships - no argument.

That said, at least in the pics Nero looks dangerous - Shinzon looks like a huffy schoolboy about to ask you if you'd like a cup of tea.
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:28 AM
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nero was a man,shinzon was a boy
nero was a villain,shinzon was confuzed
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:30 AM
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Shinzon was rubbish, full stop.
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:31 AM
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yes rubbish...correct
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Old 05-10-2009, 06:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radoskal View Post
I don't know about anyone else but I for one thought that Nero had about as much character development as a dead fish and about as much depth as a sheet of paper, I only began to appericate him as a character after I read the comic book which actually explained his motivations and showed his progression from simple ore miner to psychotic madman..(BTW i recommend Countdown to all purists, it makes the new Trek film much easier to swallow and is very well put together. But the point is I should not need to READ supplemental material to appreciate a villain half the things in countdown SHOULD have been in the new film,

but all we get is...Im angry because my planet blew up and raargh i'm going to kill things. Even Shinzon...the worst trek villain of them all,(in my opinion) was more fleshed out than Nero. In fact all I could think of when watching the film was how the two were almost the same villain, and asking myself why oh why someone would make the same mistake twice when it clearly did not work the first time.

Let's compare shall we?

Shinzon



Nero



Both are dashing bald men who come from the Romulan empire but do not consider themselves part of it. Both blame the destruction of their lives on famous federation persons, (Picard and Spock) respectively both seek to avenge themselves by constructing giant space ship monstrosities that wield some kind of doomsday device.

The Scimitar



The Narada



Both wear creepy black clothing and both are determined to kill the person who destroyed their sense of self and blow his planet up.

DejaVu for anyone else?

Nero in my opinion is the weakest villain in any Star Trek film, largely because they cut a lot of his development from the film. In the trailer we saw him breaking out of a Klingon prison.... where was that scene...we were told that he would be wonderful and a strong character...so much potential wasted so much that SHOULD have been in the film shoved into a graphic novel instead...anyone else feel this way?

anyone care to defend Nero?
Well written, Radoskal.

If I my add one thing, irrational resp. unexplained hate to make everyone in your path suffer. Scenes likes Troi's mind rape or stabbing Robau were just done to make the bad guys look horribly evil. Too blunt for my taste.
IMO, Countdown does not make Nero better. In fact, it makes him worse since from one moment to the other, he changes from Spock's friend to his enemy. And why the hell does a miner want to make everyone pay for the death of his family, why doesn't such a guy work in the military?

Not to mention that TNG era (before NEM and this movie) Romulans were interesting because they are not hot and savage Klingons but cold and witty tacticians. Nothing besides his pointed ears is Romulan about Nero.
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Old 05-10-2009, 09:36 AM
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Nero didn't construct a ship, it was a standard Romulan mining ship from the future and not very impressive by future standards; Nero just happened to be it's captain.

Other similarities are of minor note, with the exception that Nero seemed more believable and convincing than that useless Shinzon character who had his whole life to perfect being a one-dimensional plot device, as opposed to Nero who went mad with grief and bitterness after watching his whole world get wiped out. I'm glad they didn't waste too much time fleshing out Nero's character; they gave us enough information to know who he was and why he was doing what he did and left the rest of the movie for the main characters of Star Trek, which is why we went in the first place. Eric Bana made Nero very compelling with his performance considering the screentime and background story he had; the actor made the role convincing without weighing down the movie. In that respect I have absolutely no problem with how his character was handled and I simply don't equate Nero with the forgettable Shinzon.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:15 AM
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According to Countdown, the core ship was a standard mining ship, without the arms and weapon systems, the romulan military later refitted it with borg based weaponry, it defeated an entire post-nemesis era klingon fleet, then afterwards went through the black hole and back in time.

Nero is an excellent antagonist but they shouldn't have made the Narada so overwhelming. I feel it would have been better to take a straight up ship from his era, still would have been able to kick *** for everything, but it would have made it more TWOK than Probe.

I really hope they film Countdown and stick it on the dvd as a prelude to the movie.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua View Post
According to Countdown, the core ship was a standard mining ship, without the arms and weapon systems, the romulan military later refitted it with borg based weaponry, it defeated an entire post-nemesis era klingon fleet, then afterwards went through the black hole and back in time.

Nero is an excellent antagonist but they shouldn't have made the Narada so overwhelming. I feel it would have been better to take a straight up ship from his era, still would have been able to kick *** for everything, but it would have made it more TWOK than Probe.

I really hope they film Countdown and stick it on the dvd as a prelude to the movie.
That would quite posibly be the best thing ever...and if they didn't want to do more live action material they could just as easily animate it.
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