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  #21  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:30 AM
The Commodore The Commodore is offline
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It's a good point, Thascales, and that does make me think. However, two possible responses:

1. It's possible that if Nero was successful, then the Time police of the Federation would never have existed; maybe they didn't get there in time? I dunno, and I admit that's speculatory.

2. Bigger problem: if time-travel tampering was just a divergence of a new universe, why do these time-police exist? What do they care who's tampering, since any tampering at all just creates new universes and leaves the original alone? Hell, if that were the case, then time-tampering would be a humanitarian act, because you'd be creating entire universes.

Last edited by The Commodore : 05-08-2009 at 09:32 AM. Reason: want to indicate the poster's name
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  #22  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:33 AM
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kevin kevin is offline
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I think point 2 arises because Star Trek (the film) uses a different theory of time travel to the TV shows.

Previously we've been told it can all be undone and reset without damage. The film takes the opposite view.
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  #23  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:35 AM
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NCC-73515 NCC-73515 is offline
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I don't remember anyone went crazy in 1985 when Marty changed history so that his home looks cooler
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  #24  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:43 AM
The Commodore The Commodore is offline
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Well no one went crazy because there was a consistent theory within the whole series of BTTF, NCC. Kevin's point just above shows an inconsistency within the same storyline universe, about how the laws of physics work. We now each have the choice of either trying to make sense of it in a satisfactory way, or to be pragmatics.
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  #25  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:46 AM
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horatio horatio is offline
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To quote a famous Starfleet captain, from the "Prime Universe": Time travel [...] - it all gives me a headache.

So why not just accept it as something that was done, like in any previous Trek story about time travel and multi-verses, for dramatic purposes?
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  #26  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:49 AM
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NCC-73515 NCC-73515 is offline
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Well, simple solution:
When time travel happens because of:
A) Guardian, slingshot, Devidia timegate, Borg time technology -> you stay in the same universe.
B) Black Hole created by red matter (which means it could be a special black hole) -> you go to another universe.
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  #27  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:55 AM
The Commodore The Commodore is offline
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It's a good thought, and it's not inconsistent; but it's not in the script, and so while it's possible, if there were some coroboration of that it would be nice. Remember the conclusion on the bridge of the Enterprise about an alternate reality: they acted, suddenly, as though that's just the logical conclusion to come to. But still, good thought.

And Horatio: I'm in the process of "just accepting it", I have no intention of pretending it didn't happen; I just want to know the ontological repercussions of this having happened, to see whether the OOC explanation is sound.
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  #28  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCC-73515 View Post
Well, simple solution:
When time travel happens because of:
A) Guardian, slingshot, Devidia timegate, Borg time technology -> you stay in the same universe.
B) Black Hole created by red matter (which means it could be a special black hole) -> you go to another universe.
IMO, there are several parallel universes, even in the stories you categorized under A. You just wanna get back by undoing the "damage" or rather cause for your presence in that other universe, be it extinct whales, a Edith Keeler who should be dead, or Borg who have assimilated Earth-

The multi-verse idea is very close to its dramatic counterpart, "what if?". Has been like this since Well's Time Machine.
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  #29  
Old 05-08-2009, 09:58 AM
Thascales Thascales is offline
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Basically, it's hard to pin down temporal mechanics as always being a single timeline, or always being a multiverse.

As a great wise man once said, it's really a big ball of wibbly-wobbly, timey-wimey stuff.
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  #30  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Commodore View Post
Well no one went crazy because there was a consistent theory within the whole series of BTTF, NCC. Kevin's point just above shows an inconsistency within the same storyline universe, about how the laws of physics work. We now each have the choice of either trying to make sense of it in a satisfactory way, or to be pragmatics.
I don't think it can be settled in a way satisfactory for all, so I choose the pragmatic option and separate the two universes.

But that's just me.
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