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  #11  
Old 04-21-2009, 01:12 PM
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No matter how much you want this movie to take place in an alternate universe, it doesn't. Alternate timeline yes. Same universe yes. It's the past revisited. The future has yet to be written for this new timeline.
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:14 PM
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Nice thread....I like how you separated "linear" and "dimensional" time travel...

The only thing that I think doesn't work is your Delta Vega & Captain Pike examples. How would time dimensional traveling make Delta Vega (a planet) exist in a totally different location, or change Pike's age?

And to use your line of thinking, wouldn't the TNG episode "Yesterday's Enterprise" fall into both categories? When the C is thrown into the future, the D exisits in a dimensional timeline for most of the episode. But isn't it a linear time travel for the C?
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:21 PM
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Kill-joy...Just when we were all getting along...lol
Yes omegaman, your stoic pragmatism (or is that pragmatic stoicism?) is a murderer of elation!
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:50 PM
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Zim is that how Deadlock, or the fact that Jennifer Sisko is alive in the Mirror Universe?
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Old 04-21-2009, 02:04 PM
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I think that Trek as used examples of both linear and dimensional timeshifting over the years, so both could be used.

The mirror universe is possibly a dimensional shift (because in the season 6 DS9 episode Bariel transports from his universe to DS9 using something called 'a dimensional transporter) - so that seems fair. Though personally I've always thought that 'mirror' was just a fancy word for alternate myself.

Linear also seems to be the case - i.e the aforementioned 'Trials and Tribbel-ations'.

Obviously the problem is Star Trek hasn't kept to one kind of time travel, but mixed and matched to suit itself.

However - it has been acknowleged that the writers did a spot of 'relocating' of Delta Vega to move it closer to Vulcan, and Pike's age doesn't really make a huge difference.

So, I'm quite happy with the idea that Spock and Nero get pulled back from Universe A and inadvertantly create Universe B which begins the moment they arrive.

It seems perfectly straightforward.
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Old 04-21-2009, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damage75 View Post
And to use your line of thinking, wouldn't the TNG episode "Yesterday's Enterprise" fall into both categories? When the C is thrown into the future, the D exisits in a dimensional timeline for most of the episode. But isn't it a linear time travel for the C?
Again, demonstrating that time travel isn't really thought out in Trek very much.
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Old 04-21-2009, 02:13 PM
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Hey, Zim: good post!

Luckily for us, we already have two primelines to play with!

First of all, we have the Prime timeline: first seen in TOS, and last seen in VOY:Endgame. Then we have the prime timeline polluted by, first, the events of ST:FC; then the events of the Temporal cold war(to a completely unknown degree).

This could forseeably give us the variation seen before the interruption of the new film (maybe Delta Vega is actually a completely different planet, but was simply named that instead of OUR Delta Vega, Pike could have been aged unnaturally by radiation... etc).

But presumably before the new film's interference this secondary prime universe would ultimately arrive at a similar twenty fourth century to the Prime timeline! One with differences so negligible so as to be indistinguishable at a glance.
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  #18  
Old 04-21-2009, 02:52 PM
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Here's another one...what about quantum universes?

In the TNG episode "Parallels", Worf keeps moving between multiple universes, but in each his quantum signature stays the same.

Would this be the same with the new movie? Is it a sort of time traveling quantum universe? Kirk is still Kirk, but not quite. And everything around him is the same, but not quite.

The more I think about it, this maybe the closest explanation to the so-called "discrepancies" in the new movie!

Zim, when you get back here you better have alloted yourself a lot of time to read through our responses....but that's what you get when you post a time travel thread on a Star Trek forum!!!! LOL
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  #19  
Old 04-21-2009, 02:56 PM
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Well, the 'Parallells' episode is one of the references they used - because it deals with the same notion that every action you can take has a universe where you took it, and if any of those get interfered with they create another alternate and so on and so on until you have billions of them all existing.
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  #20  
Old 04-21-2009, 02:59 PM
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Exactly....except that refers to time travel in general.

Quantum universes has to do with one specific individual....or am I wrong?
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