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Old 04-21-2009, 07:09 AM
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Default Not Sure about this my Take

If Certain rumors are true... I for one may be disappointed. The Canon itself is what makes Star Trek unique... They could have followed some of it... But I understand Abrams wants this to be Fresh and new for those who are not fans thinking this will bring in more than 75 million US dollars...

I am just not sure I want to see this now.
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by DoctorWho View Post
If Certain rumors are true... I for one may be disappointed. The Canon itself is what makes Star Trek unique... They could have followed some of it... But I understand Abrams wants this to be Fresh and new for those who are not fans thinking this will bring in more than 75 million US dollars...

I am just not sure I want to see this now.
I understand exactly how you feel. We have been discussing this for many weeks on this forum. I am going to go see for myself if all the rumours are true. Hey, it's Star Trek!!!
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:44 AM
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The problem is we have an Arrogant Kirk, We have an Enterprise built in Iowa... not San Fransico... We have a Spock that will probably Distrust Kirk throughout the movie till the last half hour...

We have a possible beloved planet destroyed all for the sake of a "Reboot"...

We have Pike who by Canon only met Kirk when he took command of the Enterprise... retired from Captain... Became a Fleet Captain, and got hurt horribly on a Cadet Training mission... (Canon Fact)

The Ship and its appearance is nitpicking I can live with the changes...

Uhura Sleeping with a Young James T. Kirk, as we have seen in the previews... Does not make me feel right. She kissed him in a TOS episode there was no relationship or flirtness with her. Now maybe had it been Rand, or Chapel... okay... but why Uhura? I for one don't care about this but it violates Canon.

I fear this movie is going to be like Lost in Space... The movie...

It will have the feel of wanting to know the characters you love but than be sickened by knowing the characters you grew up 79 Plus TOS Episodes 7 Movies... (Generations with Kirk... Flop but still he was in it.) Will all be put aside for this reboot... And we the Trek fans are suppose to say, "Thanks JJ... We got our Franchise back.."
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by DoctorWho View Post
The problem is we have an Arrogant Kirk, We have an Enterprise built in Iowa... not San Fransico... We have a Spock that will probably Distrust Kirk throughout the movie till the last half hour...

We have a possible beloved planet destroyed all for the sake of a "Reboot"...

We have Pike who by Canon only met Kirk when he took command of the Enterprise... retired from Captain... Became a Fleet Captain, and got hurt horribly on a Cadet Training mission... (Canon Fact)

The Ship and its appearance is nitpicking I can live with the changes...

Uhura Sleeping with a Young James T. Kirk, as we have seen in the previews... Does not make me feel right. She kissed him in a TOS episode there was no relationship or flirtness with her. Now maybe had it been Rand, or Chapel... okay... but why Uhura? I for one don't care about this but it violates Canon.

I fear this movie is going to be like Lost in Space... The movie...

It will have the feel of wanting to know the characters you love but than be sickened by knowing the characters you grew up 79 Plus TOS Episodes 7 Movies... (Generations with Kirk... Flop but still he was in it.) Will all be put aside for this reboot... And we the Trek fans are suppose to say, "Thanks JJ... We got our Franchise back.."
Okay, here's what I have to say on these points:

- Enterprise being built in Iowa: Possible, since nothing onscreen actually established otherwise. Alternate Universe.
- Spock distrusting Kirk: This is an origin story. This is about how they become who we know.
- Arrogant Kirk: That's one thing he does have on occasion. But he gains the skills and disciplin from Starfleet, and combined, they make the James Kirk we know. Plus, Alternate Universe.
- Pike/Kirk relationship: This occurs in an alternate universe created by the one we know. Circumstances are directly changed that lead to this.
- Ship Changes: You get the picture ;-)
- Kirk sleeping with Uhura: Doesn't happen. Previews actually show an Orion girl (She's green, but the lighting is a little deceptive).
- Trek History has NOT been put aside. In terms of characterizations, from what I can gather, they got those mostly right.
- The older Spock is from the reality we already know. I'll leave it at that.

Yes, it's different, and in many ways COULD be viewed as a reboot, but it is spawned by the existing continuity.

In fact, all of the events in Enterprise still happen, since they are the same Universe until a specific divergent event.
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by DoctorWho View Post
The problem is we have an Arrogant Kirk, We have an Enterprise built in Iowa... not San Fransico... We have a Spock that will probably Distrust Kirk throughout the movie till the last half hour...

We have a possible beloved planet destroyed all for the sake of a "Reboot"...

We have Pike who by Canon only met Kirk when he took command of the Enterprise... retired from Captain... Became a Fleet Captain, and got hurt horribly on a Cadet Training mission... (Canon Fact)

The Ship and its appearance is nitpicking I can live with the changes...

Uhura Sleeping with a Young James T. Kirk, as we have seen in the previews... Does not make me feel right. She kissed him in a TOS episode there was no relationship or flirtness with her. Now maybe had it been Rand, or Chapel... okay... but why Uhura? I for one don't care about this but it violates Canon.

I fear this movie is going to be like Lost in Space... The movie...

It will have the feel of wanting to know the characters you love but than be sickened by knowing the characters you grew up 79 Plus TOS Episodes 7 Movies... (Generations with Kirk... Flop but still he was in it.) Will all be put aside for this reboot... And we the Trek fans are suppose to say, "Thanks JJ... We got our Franchise back.."
That's NOT Uhura in bed with Kirk. Uhura is definitely the one undressing, but the scene in bed is NOT Uhura and that's been discussed for months.

Arrogant Kirk? Is that so hard to believe in his youth?

Spock distrusts him? Is that really SO implausible?

I get that you don't like it...that's cool. But half of this stuff that you think is "canon violation" was NEVER touched in canon.

Can't you just wait 16 days and see how it actually goes before you hate it? Geez...
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Old 04-21-2009, 07:59 AM
Thascales Thascales is offline
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If canon has to step aside for Star Trek to be reinvigorated with believable and compelling characters, and seen by millions of new people, then canon can go jump in a lake as far as I'm concerned. It's not the most important thing about Star Trek.

Granted, it's important for the viewer that a fictional universe is self-consistent, otherwise there are no rules, and the fiction fails. But Star Trek has been accruing canon for over forty years. It's too much. Tiny details of canon are well known to many people, and the moment any writer goes even an inch off the established rails, that self-consistency rule comes back to bite them in the arse as fans bay for their blood.

In short, this reboot allows writers everywhere to breathe a sigh of relief. At last, they can create stories for Star Trek without having to worry about forgetting the phase variance of a polaron whatsimajig and how it would prevent a ship from warping under isolinear somethingorother.

Change for change's sake might not be good, but change to save Trek from dying a tax accountant's death, mumbling astoundingly uninteresting fictional statistics and minutae as it stumbles into its grave? That change is goood. So unless the Enterprise being built in San Francisco is vitally important to your enjoyment of Trek, I'd say relax, grab a drink and enjoy the show.

Last edited by Thascales : 04-21-2009 at 08:02 AM.
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Old 04-21-2009, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by DoctorWho View Post
If Certain rumors are true... I for one may be disappointed. The Canon itself is what makes Star Trek unique... They could have followed some of it... But I understand Abrams wants this to be Fresh and new for those who are not fans thinking this will bring in more than 75 million US dollars...

I am just not sure I want to see this now.
Best not to go with rumors. People have said it doesn't follow canon. People have said it does.

Personally it makes no difference. But I trust Mr. Abrams to do the right thing.

This movie is bringing back Star Trek for the masses. DoctorWho, you have to go see this movie and find out for yourself if the rumors are true.
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Old 04-21-2009, 08:13 AM
AyanEva AyanEva is offline
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In answer to everything you've said...

Alternate universe, parallel canon. Nothing has changed in the Roddenberryverse and the Abramsverse doesn't affect any of the things that you're concerned about.

Thascales: ROFL@ at your post. I can't say I disagree. My deal is, as long as I know the Roddenberryverse canon is safe, Abrams has my support in doing whatever the heck he wants with the Abramsverse. We need a fresh start in order to build the fanbase and keep the franchise going.
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Old 04-21-2009, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Thascales View Post
If canon has to step aside for Star Trek to be reinvigorated with believable and compelling characters, and seen by millions of new people, then canon can go jump in a lake as far as I'm concerned. It's not the most important thing about Star Trek.

Granted, it's important for the viewer that a fictional universe is self-consistent, otherwise there are no rules, and the fiction fails. But Star Trek has been accruing canon for over forty years. It's too much. Tiny details of canon are well known to many people, and the moment any writer goes even an inch off the established rails, that self-consistency rule comes back to bite them in the arse as fans bay for their blood.

In short, this reboot allows writers everywhere to breathe a sigh of relief. At last, they can create stories for Star Trek without having to worry about forgetting the phase variance of a polaron whatsimajig and how it would prevent a ship from warping under isolinear somethingorother.

Change for change's sake might not be good, but change to save Trek from dying a tax accountant's death, mumbling astoundingly uninteresting fictional statistics and minutae as it stumbles into its grave? That change is goood. So unless the Enterprise being built in San Francisco is vitally important to your enjoyment of Trek, I'd say relax, grab a drink and enjoy the show.
I have to agree....

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorWho View Post
If Certain rumors are true... I for one may be disappointed. The Canon itself is what makes Star Trek unique... They could have followed some of it... But I understand Abrams wants this to be Fresh and new for those who are not fans thinking this will bring in more than 75 million US dollars...

I am just not sure I want to see this now.
I know your worries here...there was a time or two in the beginning when I thought there was going to be some big disasters coming with Trek now. You my might wanna consider going on some faith here...You have probably seen every adventure that Kirk and Crew have taken on the Enterprise huh...well at the very least this is a different take with a new adventure. It doesn't take away from what you already know about Trek...it is giving you another Trek experience...that is new and unexplored. Now you can't tell me that is worth a risk or two seeing this movie with an open mind huh? You may just be missing out on a good thing..then again maybe not...it is your call friend!
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Old 04-21-2009, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Thascales View Post

Change for change's sake might not be good, but change to save Trek from dying a tax accountant's death, mumbling astoundingly uninteresting fictional statistics and minutae as it stumbles into its grave? That change is goood. So unless the Enterprise being built in San Francisco is vitally important to your enjoyment of Trek, I'd say relax, grab a drink and enjoy the show.
Hey, go easy on tax accountants... Many of my best friends are tax accountants... and we are all planning to have glorious deaths !!

(little known fact - tax accountants are truly wild and crazy people... now if you are talking about financial accountants, I am with you !!)
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