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  #11  
Old 04-06-2009, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Tom Coughlin View Post
I like a lot of what you wrote as well. The only thing that doesn't ring true to me is it seems like in trying to fit your story into what was already established in Enterprise (as I've said I believe they missed the mark when it comes to the Romulans) you are trying to find an explanation for why the technology is scaled back during the conflict. I would probably not explore that issue as in war, technology always advances. Since the technology doesn't line up, I would just roll with it. That mistake is on the writers of Enterprise, not you. You shouldn't try to stretch the logic just to make your story fit their mistake. Just my thoughts. All in all, you have some interesting ideas going on there.
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
Thanks for your input, MrQ and Coughlin.
Actually I got my idea for technological regress from BoT where Spock mentions that atomicweapons were uses in the war as well as the TNG Tech Manual which suggests that during antimatter synthesization, part of the energy is lost. But Warp 5, impulse vessels, and then Warp 6/7 is just not smooth, great point.
Well I read the whole thing.
I can see the purpose of story but I honestly think it focuses to closely to known characters. I don't think you should be hesitant to create new characters to focus on and create real emotional issues and tactical challenges for them to over come.

For instance:

The NX-01 could be there but wouldn't Archer be an Admiral or even promoted half way though the war?

There are some technical issues. The High Command was pointed out eariler. The Romulan War was over the territory that is now the Neutral Zone and according to the Star Charts that's about 30 something lightyears from Earth and particularly over a Planet called Nelvana III.

Since this war was about Territory does involve territory just like the Dominion War don't rule out a Romulan First Strike.

What you should really keep in this draft is the idea of melding the two conflicting Star Trek's together. Your reasoning for why more NX class ships were created is more than sound. Those ships run on anti-matter. Making that fuel is troublesome. When the war goes into full steam the ships on the line would be standard hydrogen Fussion ships, that means photon torpedoes would be out and the high powered phase weapons would be a no go as well.

What Star Trek needed was a Stepping Stone...Provide it with your story. Introduce Impulse Technology that changed the course of the War. Tom is right Wars always produce more Technology. So if the Romulans only had Impulse technology back in Kirks day then that means they were a hundred years behind the Federation and that mean at the time of the Romulan War they were also behind Earth.

So perhaps the turning point of the War was the development of Advanced Fusion Technology and as a result Impulse Technology which is based on Fussion. How that happens who knows. But it puts scientist in the hot seat to come up with a solution and that where the three species can come into play.

It's good to see you're excercising your English in such a way, You're sure to benefit from it.
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  #12  
Old 04-06-2009, 11:34 AM
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I think that Enterprise pretty well establishes that warp drive is the standard of the day, even though most ships were not warp 5 capable. There is no reason to believe that there is any shortage in fuel. To me, the difference between what had been stated in TOS and what is seen in Enterprise really isn't something that can be reconciled. It would be like taking everything you have ever learned about the American Civil war, and then seeing that war portraid with Aircraft carriers and tanks. Trying to find an explanation for the difference in technological capabilites of the era given in Enterprise and TOS is just trying to put square pegs in round holes.
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  #13  
Old 04-06-2009, 12:38 PM
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First Contact establishes antimatter matter reactors 200 years before there supposed to be. People previously blamed Gene's Vision for this kind of odd occurences but the truth is that he gave 100 years for every significant progression of Tech. 100 years of Fusion, 100 Years of Impulse Power and finally to advanced Impulse and 1st Generation Matter and Anti matter reactors.

I know what you're saying but I agree with attempt to mend the canon.
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Old 04-06-2009, 12:43 PM
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I think if you're writing a story and you want to amend that canon, then you just go with my suggestion of ignoring the technology shown in Enterprise and write a story more in line with what was mentioned in TOS. Any attempt to try and fuse the two different levels of technology will just come across as a contrived devise to make things fit that just don't fit. Kind of a common mistake in Star Trek actually, like how they say the Eugenics wars happened in the 90's (I believe they mention that in Voyager for instance) and I guess we just didn't notice it. Contrived.
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  #15  
Old 04-06-2009, 12:54 PM
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I think a Romulan/Earth War as the writers originally planned it during the Motion Picture years would have been quite fascinating from the low tech concept Fusion and Atomics.

I think Melding the two is possible, if not diffcult to do well and convincingly. I consider the worst of the continuity issues to be challenges not true barriers...

Ultimately when we start to get into the Romulan tech with a war fought with cloaks...even I would ahve a hard time explaining how Star Fleet defeated them...They really shouldn't have.

Enterprise was a massive fumble, I know....but my gut tells me it may can be saved.
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Old 04-06-2009, 01:01 PM
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The Romulans had cloaking devices during the Earth/Romulan War? I know they had them in Enterprise which predated but, from the perspective of BOT, did they ever make that clear, whether the Romulans used cloaking technology in the war?
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  #17  
Old 04-06-2009, 01:28 PM
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@Livingston: In the second season episode "Minefield" the Romulan had cloaks. It was considered to be an error by the producers and it was not seen again in the fourth season Romulan three-parter.

@Saquist: Thanks for your input. I actually took a look on Mandel's Star Charts and he also set the war at about what later became the Neutral Zone. That's the best spot to set the story if humans use warp ships, if it is war about territory. But I wanted to continue to ideas of Enterprise (only two warp 5 ships) and BoT ("primitive atomic weapons") so a lot of fusion powered impulse driven ships with H bombs aboard seemed to be the way to go. In this case, the range of the ships is quite limited and I had to set the war as close to Earth as possible, Alpha Centauri (yet four lightyears would still be too far away for impulse driven ships). Then a Romulan base in that system and a war of attrition seemed to be just the next step.

@Coughlin: I don't think that a few lines from BoT should be considered to be more important than an entire series. The distances between Romulus and Earth would be too large to be covered by sub-light vessels. How can humans interact with Vulcans if 40 Eridiani is 16 light years aways from Earth and create the UFP shortly after the war?

I just tried to fit my story idea into continuity as well as possible. The Greek names, the relationship between the five races and the way a war might change humans and nearly destroy all that has been build up in the last hundred years seemed to be more interesting to me than the technical side.

Last edited by horatio : 04-06-2009 at 01:31 PM.
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  #18  
Old 04-06-2009, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Livingston View Post
The Romulans had cloaking devices during the Earth/Romulan War? I know they had them in Enterprise which predated but, from the perspective of BOT, did they ever make that clear, whether the Romulans used cloaking technology in the war?
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Originally Posted by horatio View Post
@Livingston: In the second season episode "Minefield" the Romulan had cloaks. It was considered to be an error by the producers and it was not seen again in the fourth season Romulan three-parter.
Little we can do now. It's canon.

Quote:
@Saquist: Thanks for your input. I actually took a look on Mandel's Star Charts and he also set the war at about what later became the Neutral Zone. That's the best spot to set the story if humans use warp ships, if it is war about territory. But I wanted to continue to ideas of Enterprise (only two warp 5 ships) and BoT ("primitive atomic weapons") so a lot of fusion powered impulse driven ships with H bombs aboard seemed to be the way to go. In this case, the range of the ships is quite limited and I had to set the war as close to Earth as possible, Alpha Centauri (yet four lightyears would still be too far away for impulse driven ships). Then a Romulan base in that system and a war of attrition seemed to be just the next step.

I see.
Consider the following.

Eariler in another thread I another member put forth the understanding that the Romulan War was Indeed fought with Warp Capable ships. However while they were not powered with matter/anti-matter reactors they could be fought with the new impulse technology that resulted from the NX project. While Impulse power can't energize high powered warp fields It could get us to warp three.

The big goof of Star Trek was First Contact which told us through Geordi that the pheonix had a warp core. Details are so important. It described an intermix chamber who's purpose is to mix matter and antimatter.

Several members were annoyed with my Space Flight Chronology references yet they propperly outline a progression from the first Warp two to warp 5 in three different Generations of warp drive.

This is the only option we could think of.
The truth is, it's impossible to wage a war at the distance of even 1 lightyear with sublight engines. At .5 of light speed it would take 10 years. The interchanges would occur with preplanned ships in position...much like the book, Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card.

FTL is the only option.
Traveling 60 lightyears at .5 to reach Earth would take 604 years.
So with the Fussion power ships it is possible to power warp drive although slowly. At warp 3.5 it would take around Five Months to reach the conflict area for both sides and arrange an attack plan. Both sides would have not choice but to go directly to the point of conflict to prevent ships from slipping through to reach home worlds. The Chronology says the war was 3 years long and that would make time for at least 3 different conflicts giving time for ships to return and report back.

I know you said that technical issues aren't important to you but I wanted to spell out exactly what that means in this case. Sublight travel is absolutely impossible to have an exhange.
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  #19  
Old 04-07-2009, 04:12 AM
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It is indeed a bit strange to assume that warp coils, the ability to synthesize antimatter in sufficiently large quantities and antimatter containment get developed at the same time. Cochrane might be smart, but three break-through technology innovations are a bit much for one man.

Fusion-powered low warp flight is a great idea.
"Primitive atomic weapons" implies that hydrogen bombs were used, the idea of net energy loss in antimatter synthesization rationalizes a change aways from matter-antimatter to fusion power in ship propulsion as well as torpedo technology (in case Starfleet already used matter-antimatter warheads) during war times, but travel at sublight speed was the main unrealistic part of my rough story idea.
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  #20  
Old 04-07-2009, 04:47 AM
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It was the only real problem I saw in your plan.
I am impressed that you would tackle the Earth Romulan War, Horatio. It won't be easy, I've tried, perhaps not hard enough, but character development has always been my weak point.
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