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  #41  
Old 03-09-2009, 07:45 AM
liamb14 liamb14 is offline
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Lets also not forget that somehow Scotty gets to be Chief Engineer (I think) whilst being banned from Starfleet all together. Just a thought.
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  #42  
Old 03-09-2009, 08:41 AM
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Banned from Starfleet? I thought he was just assigned to a dead-end remote outpost as punishment...as in "forget about the rest of your career, Mr. Scott, there's no redemption for pissing off an admiral..."
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  #43  
Old 03-09-2009, 09:22 AM
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Banned from Starfleet? I thought he was just assigned to a dead-end remote outpost as punishment...as in "forget about the rest of your career, Mr. Scott, there's no redemption for pissing off an admiral..."
I have to agree...Why ban someone from a Military like organization when you can just punish them? Our military is like that...Soldier you just signed you arse over to Uncle Sam. You screw up just once you will be in a place so gawd-awful, Hades will look like summer camp.
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  #44  
Old 03-09-2009, 01:21 PM
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I will agree that that's possible.....I just don't know, seeing how Kirk is the only one NOT wearing a rank or even a branch color. You'd think there'd be plenty of upstart Ensigns or Lieutenants grabbing for that chair.
Did anyone notice what else Kirk is wearing when he sits in the center chair?

He's still wearing his 'snow boots' from the ice planet, and in all those shots, he does not appear to be in anything resembling official 'dress' uniform... perhaps for a good story reason. It might be something as logical as covert soldiers not carrying anything to identify them easily by sight or in case of capture.

If Kirk is still in his snow boots, I'm guessing he didn't have time to change clothes/uniform from his extraction from the ice planet, and that would also fit with circumstances for the ship having no captain or first officer to assume command.

Clearly this is a crisis moment aboard ship, and the fact that Kirk isn't wearing a uniform *at the moment* is not going to stop him from assuming command when the gagh is hitting the fan. Stripes or insignia don't matter, saving the ship and crew does -- Kirk is taking command, not making a fashion statement.
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  #45  
Old 03-09-2009, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by MissionTrek08 View Post
Did anyone notice what else Kirk is wearing when he sits in the center chair?

He's still wearing his 'snow boots' from the ice planet, and in all those shots, he does not appear to be in anything resembling official 'dress' uniform... perhaps for a good story reason. It might be something as logical as covert soldiers not carrying anything to identify them easily by sight or in case of capture.

If Kirk is still in his snow boots, I'm guessing he didn't have time to change clothes/uniform from his extraction from the ice planet, and that would also fit with circumstances for the ship having no captain or first officer to assume command.

Clearly this is a crisis moment aboard ship, and the fact that Kirk isn't wearing a uniform *at the moment* is not going to stop him from assuming command when the gagh is hitting the fan. Stripes or insignia don't matter, saving the ship and crew does -- Kirk is taking command, not making a fashion statement.
It pretty clear to the bridge crew that Pike believes strongly in Kirk's abilities and that Kirk is more suited to the task of commanding.
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  #46  
Old 03-09-2009, 04:00 PM
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I suspect that the approach to training and promotions in the movie stems partially from the nature of their training at the Academy.

Kirk is trained for Command after the basic training (perhaps forst 2 years is basic, followed by 2 years of specialist training, such as Command, Engineering etc., usually tailored to a cadet's natural aptitude).

Kirk not being given a position on a ship, such as a Command officer in training (like an apprenticeship, gaining experience and knowledge by working closely with the CO), could be due to the Kobayashi Maru situation.

This is akin to being stopped from graduating due to accusations of cheating, and not getting your Diploma (yellow shirt).

When Spock and Pike are out of action, it means Kirk is the only one with the training to take command of the ship.

The rest of the crew might also be placed in their positions through field commissions, with the usual officers taken out/killed/incapacitated in some way during the movie.

Kirk then has no choice but to take command, having earned the respect and loyalty of the crew through his actions and initiative up to that point.

Later on, we may get to see Kirk with the Command Yellow shirt and Captain rank, perhaps right before the big finale, or perhaps right at the end as a result of the finale, and in recognition of what he did.
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  #47  
Old 03-09-2009, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissionTrek08 View Post
He's still wearing his 'snow boots' from the ice planet, and in all those shots, he does not appear to be in anything resembling official 'dress' uniform... perhaps for a good story reason. It might be something as logical as covert soldiers not carrying anything to identify them easily by sight or in case of capture.
Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by omegaman View Post
It pretty clear to the bridge crew that Pike believes strongly in Kirk's abilities and that Kirk is more suited to the task of commanding.
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneBuckFilms View Post
I suspect that the approach to training and promotions in the movie stems partially from the nature of their training at the Academy.

Kirk is trained for Command after the basic training (perhaps forst 2 years is basic, followed by 2 years of specialist training, such as Command, Engineering etc., usually tailored to a cadet's natural aptitude).

Kirk not being given a position on a ship, such as a Command officer in training (like an apprenticeship, gaining experience and knowledge by working closely with the CO), could be due to the Kobayashi Maru situation.

This is akin to being stopped from graduating due to accusations of cheating, and not getting your Diploma (yellow shirt).

When Spock and Pike are out of action, it means Kirk is the only one with the training to take command of the ship.

The rest of the crew might also be placed in their positions through field commissions, with the usual officers taken out/killed/incapacitated in some way during the movie.

Kirk then has no choice but to take command, having earned the respect and loyalty of the crew through his actions and initiative up to that point.

Later on, we may get to see Kirk with the Command Yellow shirt and Captain rank, perhaps right before the big finale, or perhaps right at the end as a result of the finale, and in recognition of what he did.
As far as I can tell, the only reference we have to Kirk being a cadet at this time was from some bit of the movie that someone saw overseas, right? Something like Spock saying "The cadet has a point Captain"?

Let's say that was a mistake. Whose to say that Kirk isn't a lieutenant, or even a lieutenant commander? If we go by the shuttle shot from the trailer, McCoy and Kirk are on it together. In the scene where Kirk takes command, McCoy has at least lieutenant braids on, right?

Unless you want to say doctors advance quicker, why is McCoy higher in rank? And I don't like the Kobayashi Maru excuse either. I can see him getting passed up for something because of it, but not being held back what would appear to be years because of it.

Maybe the clothes he is wearing are just for covert reasons, and not a cadets uniform. Or maybe the only thing he could wear that would be inconspicous as he was being smuggled aboard by McCoy was a cadets uniform.
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  #48  
Old 03-09-2009, 07:48 PM
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As far as I can tell, the only reference we have to Kirk being a cadet at this time was from some bit of the movie that someone saw overseas, right? Something like Spock saying "The cadet has a point Captain"?
From a TrekMovie.com Spoiler Article:

From Anthony Pasquale TrekMovie Report on Preview


I don't think it was a mistake considering the source *SPOILERS*:
http://trekmovie.com/2008/11/20/anth...-presentation/
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  #49  
Old 03-09-2009, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OneBuckFilms View Post
From a TrekMovie.com Spoiler Article:

From Anthony Pasquale TrekMovie Report on Preview


I don't think it was a mistake considering the source *SPOILERS*:
http://trekmovie.com/2008/11/20/anth...-presentation/
Excelent reading, I enjoyed that, thank you.
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