[Zardoz]

Originally Posted by Elizadolots

Hi, Mission! I've always been checking the board, but got involved in issues elsewhere.

I think Shore Leave is the ultimate episode to point to in support of the idea Kirk enjoys a good fight at times.



I think another good example is By Any Other Name when the members of the crew are tasked with "stimulating" the aliens....and Kirk does it by first flirting shamelessly with (and kissing) the female and then engaging in a fist fight with the top male.

kevin has put together a good list of some of Kirk's more notable fights. I think these two stand out because in both cases, it's a choice for Kirk to engage and he appears to derive pleasure from the experience.

On the question of what starts the fight, didn't we get that earlier when Abrams took 4 big clips on a world tour?

What I Remember Happening

Kirk is in the bar ordering a Budweiser when Uhura walks in...he appreciates what he sees but his "pick up line" is crude. Something along the lines of "you're in communications....you must have a very skilled tongue" She reacts with visible disdain and Sulu comes to ask if "this tough" is giving her a hard time....they start fighting.

Eliza-

I totally agree!

[martok2112]

Originally Posted by Saquist

Uptight: edgy: being in a tense state
I don't believe a definition can have emotions.

Ok, Saquist, I really enjoy having discussions with you, particularly if it can lead to mutual enlightenment. But, respectfully, the Vulcan act HAS to go. Remember, thou art human. And thy logic falters as much as the next human's...forsooth.

Originally Posted by Saquist

Negative: I am taught that "buzzed" driving is drunk driving. Therefore drunk and buzzed are synonyms.

I've seen those commercials too.

While I appreciate your statement, driving is irrelevant to the discussion, as pertains to James T. Kirk.

But, if you wish to pursue that route, then yes, buzzed driving is drunk driving as pertains to the law. The commercials you've been "taught" by are propaganda messages meant to instill fear into those who would consider driving with a buzz. As a rule: Buzzed driving is ill advised, and yes, if you are caught, you will be arrested and prosecuted as a "drunk" driver. It's part of municipal authorities' programs to attempt to crack down on impaired driving as a result of alcohol intake.

A child might get tried as an adult for committing a heinous crime....murder, sexual assault, what have you. Does that mean the child is an adult? No. He/she is simply being tried under the context of an adult case.

Same thing with buzz vs. drunk. You are being charged as a drunk driver, even if you are buzzed. It still does not mean you ARE drunk. You are simply paying the price for your indiscretion.

But, driving aside, a buzz is different from being drunk. A buzz is not on the same intensity as drunkenness. Having a buzz, one still has general control over their mental faculties....they're just a little more relaxed. Drunk is when up is down is left is right is floor is who's that woman in my bed!?

Originally Posted by Saquist

Confirmed:

*Note: Definitions will vary.

-The statements linking alcoholism and the discriptive moniker, drunk, are withdrawn.- SaQ

So noted.

Originally Posted by Saquist

Statements describing James T. Kirk as a person who regularly consumes alcoholic beverages.
Sustained.

Statements defining James T. Kirk as a person who habitually and chronicly...(being long-lasting and recurrent or characterized by long suffering. ) abuses alcohol continue to be opposed.

Kirk's ingestion or abuse of alcohol on marked occasions does not substaniate the terms drunk or drinker by means of an excessive trend establishing a character defining trait.

Kirk's character, whilst ficticious, is a human being, subject to the same frailties and flaws that can inflict other human beings. Beyond this, I will just sit back with the popcorn, and watch the debate ring on. My only purpose here was to provide enlightenment as to the differences between drunkards, alcoholics, buzzes, and being drunk.

I respectfully stand down, as I feel I have presented my case well, and feel no further need to elaborate. IOW, I rest my case.

Respectfully,
Steve (aka Martok)

[horatio]

Kirk (and I say this as someone who prefers Picard) is a great captain althoug he chases skirts on every second planet, although he takes too much of Saurian Brandy or Romulan ale once in a while, although he likes a good fight. That's the terrific thing about him, he can be a great captain without denying his human faults (@Saq: the guy is human, he does not have pointed ears last time I checked).

Even Spock learned something from Kirk in his later years, cowboy diplomacy (although the term comes from Picard, it is not hard to figure out where Spock learned his unusual and highly illogical approach to Romulan-Vulcan unification, an endeavour which is itself nearly hopeless).

[Saquist]

Originally Posted by martok2112

Ok, Saquist, I really enjoy having discussions with you, particularly if it can lead to mutual enlightenment. But, respectfully, the Vulcan act HAS to go. Remember, thou art human. And thy logic falters as much as the next human's...forsooth.

Martok2112, time is insufficient to adequately relate my experiences which have inexorably driven me to be as I am. I will say I am at my best when emotion is at a minimum.

I've seen those commercials too.

While I appreciate your statement, driving is irrelevant to the discussion, as pertains to James T. Kirk.

But, if you wish to pursue that route, then yes, buzzed driving is drunk driving as pertains to the law. The commercials you've been "taught" by are propaganda messages meant to instill fear into those who would consider driving with a buzz. As a rule: Buzzed driving is ill advised, and yes, if you are caught, you will be arrested and prosecuted as a "drunk" driver. It's part of municipal authorities' programs to attempt to crack down on impaired driving as a result of alcohol intake.

Buzzed:
1. the feeling of being inebriated from alcohol or any mind-altering substance ~urban dictionary

1. Slightly intoxicated.~wiktionary

Inebriation:
1. Drunkenness is the state of being intoxicated by consumption of alcoholic beverages to a degree that mental and physical faculties are noticeably impaired.

Intoxication:
1.The condition of being drunk. An abnormal state that is essentially alcohol poisoning. It is characterized by slurred speech and a loss of coordination.

Kirk's character, whilst ficticious, is a human being, subject to the same frailties and flaws that can inflict other human beings. Beyond this, I will just sit back with the popcorn, and watch the debate ring on. My only purpose here was to provide enlightenment as to the differences between drunkards, alcoholics, buzzes, and being drunk.

I respectfully stand down, as I feel I have presented my case well, and feel no further need to elaborate. IOW, I rest my case.

Respectfully,
Steve (aka Martok)

Indeed you have.
\\// Peace and long life.

[martok2112]

Originally Posted by Saquist

Martok2112, time is insufficient to adequately relate my experiences which have inexorably driven me to be as I am. I will say I am at my best when emotion is at a minimum.

Understood. And my apologies for my insensitivity.

Originally Posted by Saquist

Indeed you have.
\\// Peace and long life.

Many thanks, my friend.

\\//Live Long And Prosper

[Damage75]

[quote]

Originally Posted by martok2112

I've seen those commercials too.

LOL. And don't forget the after school specials!

I'll take a guess: WAY too much tv!