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Old 09-06-2008, 12:25 AM
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Default What is the ceiling for this film?

Alright, lets say this film is the modern Citizen Kane (I know, it's not possible but for the sake of argument lets roll with it). How much could this film make? Could it ever win best picture or due to the fact it is Trek, that simply isn't possible? What do you think? Have at it....
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Old 09-06-2008, 12:32 AM
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I dont know for the acting but it wii definently win an oscar for special fx
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:02 AM
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Most high concept films are at an automatic disadvantage for Oscars. I'm not sure if the door is formally locked to them or merely informally, but either way it comes out the same. A Star Trek film has about as much chance of taking home the little golden man as a Friday the 13th film, and it's not because of spaceships or gore. Both are considered light Saturday night entertainment rather than "serious" cinema.
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:38 AM
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Look,i agree with u,but star trek has about 10 oscar nominees,dont u think its time for a win,i mean u see fantasy craps like attack of the clones and become an automatic nominee,why?
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:49 AM
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Oh, I didn't say genre and franchise films can't get the noms, they can and do. And as I said, I haven't looked into why this glass ceiling exists or just how formal it is, but I can give you some good guesses:

1. The industry doesn't take them that seriously.
2. Franchises are solid financial performers, for the most part, but its the 'new' and the 'fresh' that get the critics' attention the most easily and the most strongly. A high concept piece like '12 Monkeys' might get some critical nods the first time around, but they tend to stop paying attention after the first installment.
3. High concept films tend not to be four-quadrant films and don't generate a wide enough response to engage the Academy's interest. To explain the jargon: studios view audiences as falling into four quadrants - men, women, under 25 and over 25. Animated Disney flicks are mostly one- and two-quadrant films as they appeal to male and female viewers under 25. Star Trek films have for the most part been one- and two-quadrant films appealing to men under and, then over, 25. That's not to say that women don't watch them, of course, but not strongly enough to represent strong female under-and-over quadrants.

That's why you see very few "dumb comedies", horror films or blatant "chick flicks" take home the statuette -- dumb comedies tend to be two-quadrant, male/female under 25, horror flicks the same, chick flicks I don't need to explain.
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:57 AM
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Having had a think about it, and it depends very much on what the finished film is like, but regarding Oscars I would think it unlikely to be featured outside maybe the likes of score, editing, visual effects, make-up etc. The Oscars are (wrongly for the most part) the preserve of dull but worthy cinema (you biopics, period drama's, true stories. military and American history stuff) with only the odd lighter comedy etc getting in once in a while - Shakespeare in Love, As Good as it Gets etc. Darker films like Horror have an even harder lot (isn't Silence of the Lambs still the only horror/thriller to win Bes Picture, Actor/Actress etc) and Sci-fi just virtually never gets a look in basically because it's overlooked as little green men and laser guns. It's a stigma, unfortunately that the Academy possesses and isn't likely to shake off anytime soon.

But to be honest as much I like finding out who wins what etc the Oscars frequently go in the wrong direction for me (A Beautiful Mind, for example) so I wouldn't be upset if Star Trek was overlooked. I would expect it really.
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:00 AM
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Thrillers often do get serious consideration -- Silence of the Lambs was probably judged in that context -- as they are indeed four quadrant films.
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Saint View Post
Oh, I didn't say genre and franchise films can't get the noms, they can and do. And as I said, I haven't looked into why this glass ceiling exists or just how formal it is, but I can give you some good guesses:

1. The industry doesn't take them that seriously.
2. Franchises are solid financial performers, for the most part, but its the 'new' and the 'fresh' that get the critics' attention the most easily and the most strongly. A high concept piece like '12 Monkeys' might get some critical nods the first time around, but they tend to stop paying attention after the first installment.
3. High concept films tend not to be four-quadrant films and don't generate a wide enough response to engage the Academy's interest. To explain the jargon: studios view audiences as falling into four quadrants - men, women, under 25 and over 25. Animated Disney flicks are mostly one- and two-quadrant films as they appeal to male and female viewers under 25. Star Trek films have for the most part been one- and two-quadrant films appealing to men under and, then over, 25. That's not to say that women don't watch them, of course, but not strongly enough to represent strong female under-and-over quadrants.

That's why you see very few "dumb comedies", horror films or blatant "chick flicks" take home the statuette -- dumb comedies tend to be two-quadrant, male/female under 25, horror flicks the same, chick flicks I don't need to explain.

Obviously u know things i dont,and thats good,iam always eager to learn
but from a personal point of view i want star trek to get an oscar badly,dont u?
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:06 AM
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Yes, but is is a relatively uncommon type of film to have been so widely nominated in the first place. I mean, it deserved them, I don't say otherwise. But it's should be the case more often. Should Best Picture only be about worthyness? In theory, why shouldn't top class blockbusters like Jurassic Park, The Dark Knight, etc be considered as well. They're populist, but they are as good as some past winners!!
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin View Post
Yes, but is is a relatively uncommon type of film to have been so widely nominated in the first place. I mean, it deserved them, I don't say otherwise. But it's should be the case more often. Should Best Picture only be about worthyness? In theory, why shouldn't top class blockbusters like Jurassic Park, The Dark Knight, etc be considered as well. They're populist, but they are as good as some past winners!!

Ok true,give oscars to dramas and stuff,but my opinion is that oscars go to unworthy features about 80%.I mean, they give 12 oscars to lord of the rings or star wars and alfred hitckoc(the guy who re-invented cinema as we know it) has none.Its all politics man,you cant compete spielberg or lucas,they own the business,thats why every FLOP they make is an academy nominee or winner
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