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  #91  
Old 05-16-2008, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris Fawkes View Post
Hoiw do they get in illegallly in thr first place? or do they enter legally and just not leave?
BOTH.
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  #92  
Old 05-16-2008, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by wal View Post
You mean the left wing propoganda "news" site the Clinton News Network?

Um- yes it is.
And FOX news is pro-Bush? I will admit that the news organizations may air stories and NOT others based on a bias for or against an administration. What I do NOT believe is that they mis-report or lie in order to support ANY president. I used the CNN story because it reports on the held beliefs of many economists. Now there are econimists out there that will say the opposite, but the MAJORITY of economists believe that the illegal immigrants in our country put more IN to our economy than they TAKE. Reports of money spent on illegals within our government is but a small part of the big picture. I do not doubt the validity of the reports linked to on the site Petulance refered.
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  #93  
Old 05-16-2008, 10:52 AM
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Chris Fawkes Chris Fawkes is offline
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Originally Posted by Zardoz View Post
AUS or USD?
USD if he pays now. AUD if he pays in 21 days. I think one of your dollars will equal ten of ours by that time.
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  #94  
Old 05-16-2008, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
You, my friend are pathetic in not reading over every article and fact.. this paper was from 2003, but it is the most complete article that we have today that actually links to federal documents and official reports.. and today, the ammounts and numbers just increase. Show me your links to Federal documents.. not CNN.. but hard evidence..
I will NOT respond in the manner you may believe. I called your statements pathetic because you called Mexicans pathetic for not revolting. I made comments to this in another post. All the information on thos documents must be put into context of the economy as a whole, not just a small slice of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
What can we do about it.. completely shut the borders to everyone except those that are properly documented..
I think that is the idea. The question is "HOW". I have already said I would support a fence if the Border Patrol said they needed a fence. Or any other means we may have. No argument here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Deport illegals at the Country of origin expense.. make them pay.. maybe that will make them enforce border security of their country better.. if they refuse to pay, place tarriffs and embargos on their country until either the amount is settled or until enough time has passed that the net economic result would equal the amount that they owe us for exportation..
We already deport. The part about charging the government of origin...highly unlikely. I doubt you'll find many Republicans in office that support this. If we could actually collect, why not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Offer Illegals a chance to become a US Citizen.. but they must 1st submit to lie detector screnings at help determine the amount of time they have been in the US, and then 2nd give them a net amount of back taxes to pay based off their previous wages and time working in the US..
You are getting better, but the lie detector part is probably a bot too invasive for most people's taste, even conservatives. Lie detector tests are not cheap...they would add a HUGE cost considering the number of illegal immigrant that would be invloved. I think the most likely outcome (if there is ever reform or compromise), will be a set dollar amount for all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Have INS grant temp work visa to those willing to concede to the above in order to make the money to cover their back taxes. This will give them a legitimate right to work in the US as well as give them incentive to become US Citizens. It would be completely legal..
Completely agree. I already made a similar statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
For those Illegals that have had children in the US, by law, that makes them resident aliens due to the child being a US Citizen by birth. Citizenship could be offered to them as well after submitting to the above..
Agreed. But I thought those with U.S. born children (therefore citizens) were already granted citizenship? I will have to go back and read your posts because I thought you said that was how your father-in-law got his citizenship. Doesn't matter really, just curious. The above would be good too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Drug screening would need to be done on all individuals that are wanting to become US Citizens.. a positive result would mean denial of citizenship. This would be used to help reduce the distribution of narcotics in the US..
I am not against drug screening. I believe the same is true for those that have commited crimes here. It would be a hard sell and probably unlikely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Remove the Social Security, medicare, medicade, and housing benifits for Illegals. Have Hospitals require valid US Identification or Valid INS Identification prior to recieving services.. failure to produce ID would result in being turned away. It is illegal in every state to not have an ID on you. The law is "Failure to Identify" which can result in arrest for a misdemeanor and a fine of up to $500. Hospitals can be equiped with the new Police ID card scanners for NCIC processing.. this can be tied in to the Sherrifs and police departments for apprehension of those carrying Fake IDs.

That sounds harsh, but if we make the US as unwelcoming to illegals as possible, then hopefully they will decide something different than hopping our borders..
I hope you do not really think it is humane to deny medical services. Enough said. What would be next? "where is your insurance card?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
However as another incentive, we could also offer amnesty and citizenship to their immediate family (wife and kids, not parents, brothers or sisters) for becoming Legal US Citizens..
Great idea!! This is why I started this thread. To brain-storm with fellow Trekies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Limit the amout of money sent out of the United States by injunctioning Banks as well as private services like Western Union. Set a limit of $300 / mo... This would result in the US only losing approx 3.39 billion a year compared to losing 12 to 14 billion currently (just checked current figures). Network all their systems so that an individual could not use Western Union and then go to the local bank to do the same thing..
I don't think this is possible. Once someone earns the money, it is their property and they can do with it as they wish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
There are many things that America could do.. It would be classified as "Tough Love" and make many people wake up and start reading and understanding the Law instead of just letting things slide.. America is way too liberal today.. .
We may disagree about how liberal America is, but tough love is needed in MANY areas, including our own citizens that use welfare as a lifestyle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
I agree we have been on the decline for the last 3 decades.. and for the last 3 decades it has been the liberals getting their way.. Do your own research.. it goes hand in hand...
Well, at one point it was ok to own slaves. Then woman wanted the vote. We used to have "seperate but equal",etc... You get my point. I believe "conservatives" at those times also complained of what "liberals" were doing.
(I am NOT saying you support any of those examples)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Conservatives believe in keeping America strong and also not be taken advantage of. Yes, other countries need help.. but the best help that they could recieve is from their own people making a change... When that fails, then we can send our people in and asist, as long as the the end result produces a democratic society..
I believe democrats, republicans, and independants ALL want to keep America strong. The disagreement is "HOW"?

We do send support throughout the globe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
You reference the Revolutionary war as compared to today.. True, the English had to wait for reinforcements coming across the ocean. Colonists were tired of being taxed without representation and as a result revolted against the established government to overthrow it and establish a new government, The people who faught were patriotic to the cause of becoming a new nation of its own accord and as such America was built by patriots..
Ok. We all know those that fought for our independance were patriots, in the truest sense of the word.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Mexico is independant just like the USA.. There is no other country governing Mexico.. so where would reinforcements come from. The population of mexico vastly outnumbers their military and police forces.. all they need to do is get orgainzed. It is not as far fetched as you make it out to be. .
Where would the weapons come from. It is illegal to own guns in Mexico. (I may have that wrong, but I am sure in many places in mexico it is illegal) This is why criminals WITH guns are soo destructive against unarmed victims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
Also, as an alternative, they can elect new officials that are independant of their current political parties.. people who have no current political ties and that are just as dirt poor as the general populace.. That would bring about a lot of change right there..
This would be nice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
I am coming up with solutions to the problem.. where are your solutions that will make a noticable change on our economy as well as deal with the Illegal Immigrants in this country..
Read my previous posts.

[quote=Pestalence_XC;53204]As for my training in the Military, Part of my Training in the Military was JTF (for those that don't know the Acronym.. Joint Task Force.. My MOS wassMP with the 545th. I was with them at Ft. Bliss, El Paso.. JTF training was just after Basic, part of the AIT.. we partnered with the Border Patrol for seek and find exercises.. did I directly arrest anyone..no.. but I was partnered with a patrol agent who made the actual arrest.. I just covered his back.. but it was over 200 arrests in 6 months.. quote]

This I can believe.
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  #95  
Old 05-18-2008, 04:23 PM
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I wanted to keep this thread going. I know there are great ideas out there waiting to be shared. Even those of us that do not agree on much, do agree on some. Discussion and debate is the key!
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