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  #21  
Old 05-02-2008, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Akula2ssn View Post
Yes, they were the only nuclear subs the US lost during the Cold War. Thresher pretty much made the news when she was lost, afterall, it was during a test dive which was monitored by a submarine rescue ship, the USS Skylark. They were 220 miles east of Cape Cod when the test began on April 10, 1963. The Skylark picked up communications from the Thresher indicating minor control difficulties and that the sub was going to blow ballast. When they asked Thresher if all was okay, the only response they got was the sound of bulkheads collapsing.

In the case of Scorpion, she made the news when she failed to arrive home on time. A massive search was conducted but found nothing. Eventually the wreck was found somewhere west the Canary Islands if I remember correctly. The bow was pointed east instead of west and the periscopes were raised. This indicated that the sub was at periscope depth. The direction the wreck was pointed indicated that they might have had some kind of casualty in the torpedo room. The captain probably thought it was a hot run (where a torpedo motor spontaneously starts up in the torpedo room or tube when it's not supposed to). I think the standard procedure would have been to look for a safe direction to jettison the torpedo. After the torpedo was jettisoned they would then do a 180 degree turn to activate a failsafe mechanism in the torpedo. There's been suspicion that the actual casualty may have been a torpedo battery fire that cause the warhead to cook off inside the sub. This may account for why the escape hatch to the torpedo room appears to have been blown open.


USS Thresher




USS Scorpion
Thank you, that is some wonderful history. I'll need to read up on that as well.

So did they ever conclude what blew the Scorpion's hatch open?
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  #22  
Old 05-02-2008, 08:21 AM
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To my knowledge, no they still haven't really agreed on a cause of Scorpion's loss. It's still highly debated. The lost escape hatch could also have been the result of water rushing into the compartment at high speed and pressure. There is actually acoustical evidence of the incident. The actual event of the sinking was detected by the SOSUS net that the Navy has, which is a network of hydrophones on the sea floor around the world. It's debatable if the analysis of the recordings indicates an explosion. Numerous agencies have analyzed it using different approaches.

The wreck is quite sobering. The conning tower was separated from the hull and the hull itself broke apart amidships. The entire cone section of the stern where the hull tapers off to where the propeller is has actually telescoped into the cylindrical portion of the hull's stern section.
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  #23  
Old 05-02-2008, 08:32 AM
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To my knowledge, no they still haven't really agreed on a cause of Scorpion's loss. It's still highly debated. The lost escape hatch could also have been the result of water rushing into the compartment at high speed and pressure. There is actually acoustical evidence of the incident. The actual event of the sinking was detected by the SOSUS net that the Navy has, which is a network of hydrophones on the sea floor around the world. It's debatable if the analysis of the recordings indicates an explosion. Numerous agencies have analyzed it using different approaches.

The wreck is quite sobering. The conning tower was separated from the hull and the hull itself broke apart amidships. The entire cone section of the stern where the hull tapers off to where the propeller is has actually telescoped into the cylindrical portion of the hull's stern section.
Is there a palce to see pics online?

Navel stuff facinates, my Grandafather was Navy during WWII.
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  #24  
Old 05-02-2008, 08:38 AM
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Here's the webpage from the Naval Historical Center:

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/s...s/ssn589-n.htm

It has a few photos of the bow and the stern. You can see the rudders and aft diving planes on the end of the stern cone that's sticking outside the hull. Another thing you may want to try is to see if you can find a copy of the History Channel program called Blind Man's Bluff. You can even buy the book Blind Man's Bluff. Both go into detail about Scorpion as well as other submarine incidents in the Cold War from the loss of Thresher and Scorpion, to the wire tapping the USS Seawolf did in the Sea of Sea of Okhotsk and the accident that led to the Soviets finding the tapping devices (think the devices are on display at the Moscow Museum), the Jennifer Project where the US tried to recover a sunken Soviet nuclear missile sub, etc.
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Old 05-02-2008, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Akula2ssn View Post
Here's the webpage from the Naval Historical Center:

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/s...s/ssn589-n.htm

It has a few photos of the bow and the stern. You can see the rudders and aft diving planes on the end of the stern cone that's sticking outside the hull. Another thing you may want to try is to see if you can find a copy of the History Channel program called Blind Man's Bluff. You can even buy the book Blind Man's Bluff. Both go into detail about Scorpion as well as other submarine incidents in the Cold War from the loss of Thresher and Scorpion, to the wire tapping the USS Seawolf did in the Sea of Sea of Okhotsk and the accident that led to the Soviets finding the tapping devices (think the devices are on display at the Moscow Museum), the Jennifer Project where the US tried to recover a sunken Soviet nuclear missile sub, etc.

Wow, never ceases to amaze how well the Sea preserves things. I'll have to check it out!!
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  #26  
Old 05-02-2008, 10:18 AM
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Going back a bit, I don't see the reason why we can't look for other Earth-like planets outside our solar system, since it can only teach us more about planet formation, system studies and such which can only make us smarter and better prepared to eventually colonize even our local planets. To eventually accomplish such missions, we'll need all the knowledge and data we can collect to make them successful.

The cost of looking for other such planets can't possibly compare to the expense of even one manned mission to Mars, either. Besides, sadly there is no public support for manned space missions, certainly not at the expense of getting serious about it again. Our massive war debt doesn't help fund such projects either.

But we can still learn and study extrasolar planet systems to increase our knowledge of how such dynamics work beyond our own local example. We shouldn't halt space exploration simply we're not firing astronauts out into space to do it.
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  #27  
Old 05-02-2008, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by MissionTrek08 View Post
Going back a bit, I don't see the reason why we can't look for other Earth-like planets outside our solar system, since it can only teach us more about planet formation, system studies and such which can only make us smarter and better prepared to eventually colonize even our local planets. To eventually accomplish such missions, we'll need all the knowledge and data we can collect to make them successful.

The cost of looking for other such planets can't possibly compare to the expense of even one manned mission to Mars, either. Besides, sadly there is no public support for manned space missions, certainly not at the expense of getting serious about it again. Our massive war debt doesn't help fund such projects either.

But we can still learn and study extrasolar planet systems to increase our knowledge of how such dynamics work beyond our own local example. We shouldn't halt space exploration simply we're not firing astronauts out into space to do it.
Nicely said Mission!
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