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Old 03-25-2008, 02:10 PM
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Default Did Seven of Nine damage female characters in future series?

I'm interested to find out if people believe that Seven of Nine's portrayal as a busty-bade in a skin-tight bodysuit damaged the image of strong female characters in future Trek series or movies?

I think she did to some extent because of how T'Pol was similarly portrayed on Enterprise. The concept of each character was good, but the execution was flawed. Had Seven not have been forced to show off her body in hopes of bringing in more male viewers, I could have taken her seriously. The same could be said for T'Pol--although a better actor couldn't have hurt there as well...

Will the new movie have skinny models with fake boobs and Botox lips parading around the ship expecting to be taken seriously?
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Old 03-25-2008, 02:12 PM
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I dont think it did any damage. I presume the character is just ignored as is T'Pols. Or do you think Seven of Nine had any effect on the development of Starbuck?

PS: Does anyone remember how SeaQuest brought in younger actors and actresses and failed anyway. I am convinced that boobs have never and nowhere improved any ratings whatsoever.
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Old 03-25-2008, 02:21 PM
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I don't believe Seven affected Starbuck because when I look at Starbuck I see a scruffy fighter pilot who smokes, drinks and curses. When I look at Seven or T'Pol I see sex citten. All three characters may have been envisioned as deep and meaningful, but it's hard to get past the curves on display in those bodysuits.
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Old 03-25-2008, 02:53 PM
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I think it was more of a case that Seven was somewhat of a contradictory nature. A woman from a race devoid of passion and sensuality walking around a skintight catsuit that leaves little to the imagination (by the way, it was a padded bra Jeri Ryan wore, she's not that busty in real life and neither is ENT's Jolene Blaylock).

Neither Seven or T'Pol needed to wear catsuits, but the decision to do so had little to do with common sense or even with the characters themselves. Seven's outfit would have made sense if she was an Orion or even a (pure-breed) Klingon woman, but not as a traumatized former Borg...
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Old 03-25-2008, 03:33 PM
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I say no, because every Character is different, and every series has a Sex Appeal Character, they're usually in the Main Cast, but in TOS they were only guest Characters.
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Old 03-25-2008, 05:15 PM
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Hey, we survived Wonderwoman running around in her underwear, we can survive Busty of Borg too.
Can't we ladies have some eye candy too? Sure, we've had hotties, but not mimbo-level hotties. (OK, ok, maybe Kirk was an honorary mimbo, albiet a bright one.)
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Old 03-25-2008, 08:17 PM
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I would have to say no as well. I thought the sking tight suit was a bit much, but let's not forget that TOS had Uhura in a mini skirt. And who could forget Yeoman Rand. Star Trek has always been dominated by Beautiful women. I for one do not object at all
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Old 03-25-2008, 08:34 PM
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I don't think she did any damage...for one thing, she didn't pick the outfit. Didn't the doctor decide what she would wear...so, the real culprits were the people who programmed the doctor...and wasn't that mostly a man (the doctor was created in his image).
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Old 03-26-2008, 06:03 AM
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Thank you for some good responses.

My opinion on the miniskirts in TOS is that, yes, they did add that T&A appeal, but all the women wore them. Seven and T'Pol stood out in a very obvious way, and no matter how the show tried to explain the need to wear a cat suit, come on, let's get real. Seven would have been a much more convincing character had she been emotionally damaged by the violation her mind and body endured at the hands of the Borg. I can't see someone in her situation happily flaunting her curves after an experience like that, quite the opposite in my mind. She should have been self-conscious to the extreme to begin with. Think of it, a really attractive woman not wanting people to look at her, but all the men's eyes mentally undressing her. She could have gradually come out of her shell as she learned to be more human and bond with the crew over the next few seasons. And as for T'Pol, well, she's a Vulcan, what logic is there to dress like that?

I enjoy looking at attractive woman as much as the next guy, but there is a time and a place for it so as to not diminish a show's legitimacy. Six on BSG is pure sex and deceit, that's her role and it works. Starbuck and Boomer are pilot's and usually wear what everyone else is wearing. Their characters have flaunted there assets on several occasions, but that has happened at appropriate times during the course of the story. Seven and T'Pol are always on display. They don't wear regulation uniforms like the rest of the crew, or even ones that really make sense for their situation. Because of that, I feel their characters lose any and all legitimacy in my eyes. They come off as being there just to draw in the horny male demographic.

This is just my opinion. I fault no one for disagreeing with me. I'm just interested to hear more opinions. Thanks!
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Old 03-26-2008, 09:32 AM
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My narrow, opinionated, and hormone-driven, unintellectual, average-male response, as follows:

...I think the question, itself, undermines much of what has made the Star Trek franchise so very enduring. There is much, both in-show and in reality, that all the Trek incarnations share that have allowed it to become a cultural phenomenon, rather than a 'cult' one.

'In Reality', I'll turn to one of my favorite authors, Heinlein. R.A.H. pointed out to those detractors who trivialized his work as 'sex-filled action stories' that the story must come first, the message second. The story is the medium by which the message is delivered - the horse for the cart, the needle for the injection. You can have the world's greatest message - but you have to get somebody to watch/read/listen to it for it to be effective.

In show - and with 'Voyager' specifically - I have always thought that the ability to show all aspects of humanity within the framework of the show was what made it so interesting. Stage actors used to have a 'standard' for greatness... the ability to make an audience laugh then cry within the space of thirty seconds. Compared to 'straight' comedy or drama, this is very difficult indeed... yet Voyager manages quite often to handle it with panache. In regards to Seven, the 'in-show' reactions to her work well, as does her own initial... indifference to her own physical form. She's not shy or body-conscious because she is not self-aware of herself as an individual within a socio-sexual setting. (Even later episodes work with this - the one with Q's son, for example, where she's 'no fun' when he snaps away her clothes.)

'In-show', it parallels real life to the degree that, yes, there are people out there with physiques that attract attention. Perhaps it is 'demeaning', in that the show does it on purpose rather than as an extension of society and personality as in real life... but, as it is a show, you'd have to make the same argument about any other aspect of it.

Picardo got the EMH role when, in audition, he ad-libbed 'I'm a doctor', not a light bulb', and it's this wry humor that made the character of The Doctor what he became. Ryan was chosen for... er, other attributes. Which is good, because if all actors were chosen on the basis of a single criteria, you'd end up with... well, either 'Hercules, The Legendary Journeys'. (on one criteria), or 'Days of Our Lives' (on another).

(*Grin*)

That's my two cents worth, (adjusted upwards for inflation.) Feel free to jump all over me, figuratively speaking.

One note to Falstaff, however - I hope I haven't offended you, implied anything about you, and you do not feel that I have directly attacked your right to ask such a question. I subscribe to Voltaire's philosophy: I may not agree with a single thing you have to say; however, I will defend, to the death, your right to say it...
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