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  #21  
Old 03-25-2008, 12:32 PM
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There is time to do many things but not time to do everything. If it fits with the story, maybe, if it is percieved as necessary, perhaps, if anyone has thought about it. I just doubt the detail to which their will to go it would be the first time such detail was made to such an effort.
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  #22  
Old 03-25-2008, 12:46 PM
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Oh, there's definitely enough time to do it and wouldn't be hard at all.
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  #23  
Old 03-25-2008, 12:58 PM
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If you notice, it seems that 99.9% of Trekkies on this site always seem to know who April is. I rarely hear someone say "Who is that?" Pretty good for a non-canon character. And I never saw TAS, so I never even knew he was referenced in it.

For that reason alone, he should be listed as 1701's first captain.

Not to mention the gap in time between the christening of the ship (canon) and when Pike took command (canon?). Someone had to be captain, why not April?
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  #24  
Old 03-25-2008, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodore View Post
Oh, there's definitely enough time to do it and wouldn't be hard at all.
From our perscpective but there is much invovled in production. The details may be percieved as merely superflous. It's JJ Abrams schedule, only he knows the itinerary.
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Old 03-25-2008, 02:13 PM
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As for TAS and Canon.. here is the facts on the subject.. Gene Roddenberry himself did not say TAS was not Canon.. his office did after negotiating contracts with Paramount..

Canon issues

At the end of the first season of Star Trek: The Next Generation, all licenses for Star Trek spin-off fiction were renegotiated and the animated series was essentially "decanonised" by Gene Roddenberry's office. Writers of the novels, comics and role-playing games were prohibited from using concepts from the animated series in their works.The Star Trek Chronology by production staffers Michael Okuda and Denise Okuda does not include the animated series, but does include certain events from "Yesteryear". The timeline in Voyages of the Imagination dates the events of the series to 2269-2270, assuming the events of the show represented the final part of Kirk's five-year mission, and using revised Alan Dean Foster stardates.
Since Roddenberry's death in 1991 and the consequent firing of Richard H. Arnold, there have been various references to the animated series in the various live-action series. In the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine episode "Once More Unto the Breach", Kor referred to his ship, the Klothos, which was first named in the TAS episode "The Time Trap". Other DS9 episodes to reference the animated series include "Broken Link", where Elim Garak mentions Edosian orchids (Arex is an Edosian) and "Tears of the Prophets" where a Miranda class starship is called the USS ShirKahr (sic) after Shikahr, the city from "Yesteryear".
More DS9 references to the animated series include the episode "Prophet Motive" where the title of healer is resurrected from "Yesteryear" as well. Vulcan's Forge is also mentioned in "Change of Heart", where Worf wants himself and Jadzia Dax to honeymoon there.
Most recently, the Star Trek: Enterprise episodes "The Catwalk" and "The Forge" included references to "Yesteryear", the latter featuring a CGI rendition of a wild sehlat. The remastered Original Series episode, Amok Time featured Shikahr in the background as Spock beams up at the episode's end.
In more recent years references to the Animated Series have also cropped up in books. M'Ress and Arex, characters from the animated series, appear in the Star Trek: New Frontier novels. A race introduced in the episode "The Jihad", represented by M/3/Green, is named as the Nasat in the Starfleet Corps of Engineers e-book novellas. These stories feature a regular Nasat character, P8 Blue. The city of ShiKahr also appears in many books.
Amarillo Design Bureau, Inc. has — as part of its license for the Star Fleet Universe series of games — incorporated many aspects of the Animated Series into its works, not least being the inclusion of the Kzinti, although in a modified form. In addition FASA used elements from the animated series in its sourcebooks and modules for its Star Trek role-playing game.
If Star Trek Enterprise had been renewed for a fifth season, the Kzinti would have been introduced. Starship designs were produced which closely resemble the Kzinti/Mirak ships from the Star Fleet Universe, a gaming universe that includes the boardgame Star Fleet Battles and its PC analogue Star Fleet Command.
On June 27, 2007, Star Trek's official site included information from the animated series into its library section of the site.

Source : http://www.answers.com/topic/star-tr...=entertainment

So again, how exactly is TAS not Canon when Enterprise and DS9, used TAS as source material?

Last edited by Pestalence_XC : 03-25-2008 at 02:16 PM.
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  #26  
Old 03-25-2008, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
From our perscpective but there is much invovled in production. The details may be percieved as merely superflous. It's JJ Abrams schedule, only he knows the itinerary.
Abrams is the director and is involved with the overall storyline, but the script (and pretty much all of the dialogue) is mostly written by Orci and Kurtzman. Mentioning April in passing would be no different than mentioning in passing any other off-screen character in any movie or television episode.
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  #27  
Old 03-25-2008, 02:25 PM
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So again, how exactly is TAS not Canon when Enterprise and DS9, used TAS as source material?
Because it doesn't matter that elements from TAS were incorporated into canon in various Trek productions if the license holder still says TAS itself isn't canon. Yes, it's an arbitrary, pick-and-choose kind of thing.
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  #28  
Old 03-25-2008, 03:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pestalence_XC View Post
As for TAS and Canon.. here is the facts on the subject.. Gene Roddenberry himself did not say TAS was not Canon.. his office did after negotiating contracts with Paramount..

Canon issues

At the end of the first season of Star Trek: The Next Generation, all licenses for Star Trek spin-off fiction were renegotiated and the animated series was essentially "decanonised" by Gene Roddenberry's office. Writers of the novels, comics and role-playing games were prohibited from using concepts from the animated series in their works.The Star Trek Chronology by production staffers Michael Okuda and Denise Okuda does not include the animated series, but does include certain events from "Yesteryear". The timeline in Voyages of the Imagination dates the events of the series to 2269-2270, assuming the events of the show represented the final part of Kirk's five-year mission, and using revised Alan Dean Foster stardates.
Since Roddenberry's death in 1991 and the consequent firing of Richard H. Arnold, there have been various references to the animated series in the various live-action series. In the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine episode "Once More Unto the Breach", Kor referred to his ship, the Klothos, which was first named in the TAS episode "The Time Trap". Other DS9 episodes to reference the animated series include "Broken Link", where Elim Garak mentions Edosian orchids (Arex is an Edosian) and "Tears of the Prophets" where a Miranda class starship is called the USS ShirKahr (sic) after Shikahr, the city from "Yesteryear".
More DS9 references to the animated series include the episode "Prophet Motive" where the title of healer is resurrected from "Yesteryear" as well. Vulcan's Forge is also mentioned in "Change of Heart", where Worf wants himself and Jadzia Dax to honeymoon there.
Most recently, the Star Trek: Enterprise episodes "The Catwalk" and "The Forge" included references to "Yesteryear", the latter featuring a CGI rendition of a wild sehlat. The remastered Original Series episode, Amok Time featured Shikahr in the background as Spock beams up at the episode's end.
In more recent years references to the Animated Series have also cropped up in books. M'Ress and Arex, characters from the animated series, appear in the Star Trek: New Frontier novels. A race introduced in the episode "The Jihad", represented by M/3/Green, is named as the Nasat in the Starfleet Corps of Engineers e-book novellas. These stories feature a regular Nasat character, P8 Blue. The city of ShiKahr also appears in many books.
Amarillo Design Bureau, Inc. has — as part of its license for the Star Fleet Universe series of games — incorporated many aspects of the Animated Series into its works, not least being the inclusion of the Kzinti, although in a modified form. In addition FASA used elements from the animated series in its sourcebooks and modules for its Star Trek role-playing game.
If Star Trek Enterprise had been renewed for a fifth season, the Kzinti would have been introduced. Starship designs were produced which closely resemble the Kzinti/Mirak ships from the Star Fleet Universe, a gaming universe that includes the boardgame Star Fleet Battles and its PC analogue Star Fleet Command.
On June 27, 2007, Star Trek's official site included information from the animated series into its library section of the site.

Source : http://www.answers.com/topic/star-tr...=entertainment

So again, how exactly is TAS not Canon when Enterprise and DS9, used TAS as source material?
I always thought of "canon" as GR's vision, and what he felt was best to include as "canon". I never knew that it was about license rights!

Sadly, that kind of cheapens it for me.

I agrre with Pestalance....if it was referenced in an episode, than how can it not be canon? And I suppose I'm looking past the "rights" to whatever is canon.

Great info above!
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  #29  
Old 03-25-2008, 04:52 PM
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Additional information about TAS being Canon :

Star Trek: The Animated Series

Star Trek: The Animated Series, or The Animated Adventures of Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek, is an Emmy Award winning animated science fiction television series set in the Star Trek universe, and a continuation of Star Trek: The Original Series. The series was aired under the name Star Trek, but it has become widely known under this longer name (or abbreviated as ST:TAS or TAS) to differentiate it from the original live action Star Trek.

Production
The series was produced by Filmation and ran for two seasons from 1973 to 1974 on NBC, airing a total of twenty-two half-hour episodes. An early Filmation proposal for this series had children assigned to each of the senior officers as cadets, including a young Vulcan for Mr. Spock. According to interviews with Norm Prescott, Paramount offered Roddenberry a substantial sum of money to abandon creative control of the project and let Filmation proceed with their "kiddy space cadet" idea. Roddenberry indignantly refused. Filmation would later develop the idea into its own original program: Space Academy.
The writers of the animated series used, essentially, the same writers' guide that was used for the live-action Star Trek: The Original Series. A copy of the "series bible", as revised for TAS, is held in the science fiction research collection at the Samuel Paley Library, Temple University, Philadelphia.
While the freedom of animation afforded large alien landscapes and believable non-humanoid aliens, budget constraints were a major concern and the animation quality was generally fair, with very liberal use of stock shots (as was often the case with many of Filmation's shows). There were also occasional mistakes, such as characters appearing on screen who were elsewhere, or a character supposed to appear on the bridge's main viewing screen, but then appears in front, indicating bad ordering of animation plates. These were typically one-off errors however. Occasionally, though, parts of episodes would be animated at a near-theatrical quality level.

Influence on later Star Trek and filmation series
The U.S.S. Enterprise in this series, while supposedly the same ship as from the original series, had a holodeck very similar to the one introduced on Star Trek: The Next Generation, which was set approximately 80 years later. It only appeared once, in Chuck Menville's "The Practical Joker" and was known as the Rec Room. This feature was originally proposed for the original series (see, e.g., Gerrold, The World of Star Trek) but was never used.
Filmation later went on to produce the hit He-Man and the Masters of the Universe (1983-85), which occasionally used modified character and set designs from ST:TAS, mostly as background material. (MOTU also had several Trek-similar stories, most notably "The Arena", which is very similar to TOS's first season episode, "Arena"). Later series also shared many of the stock sound effects from both TAS and TOS. Filmation also recycled some of the background music for TAS in their later shows Shazam!, Tarzan and the Super 7 and Sport Billy. (Some of the music had already been reused from the previous season’s Brady Kids and the Treasure Island feature, and were shared with that season’s Lassie's Rescue Rangers).
In addition, a few facts introduced in the animated series have been referenced in the live-action productions:
  • The holodeck makes its first appearance in "The Practical Joker", in which it is called the Rec Room.
  • Kirk's middle name, Tiberius, was first introduced in "Bem". After subsequently being referenced in several Star Trek novels (most notably the novelization of Star Trek: The Motion Picture by Roddenberry), the name was conclusively established as part of the Trek canon in Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country).
  • Amanda's maiden name, Grayson.
  • A second exit for the bridge, referenced in Franz Joseph's Star Fleet Technical Manual and seen in the refitted Enterprise and the NCC-1701-A from the first six Star Trek movies.
  • The kahs-wan ritual Spock endures in "Yesteryear."
  • Klingon commander Kor's command of the battlecruiser Klothos.
  • Doctor Phlox uses Edosian slugs in his medical bay, and Chef once served up Edosian sucker fish, similar to Earth's catfish, as a meal, in the series Star Trek: Enterprise. They come from the same planet as Lieutenant Arex, as do Edosian orchids mentioned by Elim Garak in Star Trek: Deep Space 9.
  • The Vulcan city, ShiKahr, has been referenced in multiple series (sometimes misspelt "ShirKahr"), and can be seen in an episode of Enterprise. A Vulcan city which looks very similar to the ShiKahr of TAS was shown in the new CGI establishing shots used in the special edition of "Amok Time".
  • Some of the worlds and aliens in the series were included in the 1989 book called Star Trek: The Worlds of the Federation.
Gene Roddenberry wanted TAS Canon.. his name is on the OFFICIAL title of TAS...


Due to negotiations with Paramount, Gene's office had no choice but to decanonize TAS per CONTRACT.. but Gene himself stated, "What is shown on the screen for Star Trek is CANON, Books, Comic Books, and Magazines are not canon."

that means no matter what Gene's office did to get production contracts with Paramount to do season 2 thru 7 of Next Generation, Gene never retracted his statement on what is Canon.. and as such TAS is still Canon per Gene Roddenberry, and it has been added to the OFFICIAL Star Trek website, StarTrek.com, which only contains Official Star Trek Canon references...

And according to StarTrek.com, Captain Robert April is the first Captain of the Enterprise with Captain Christopher Pike as the Enterprise's second Captain, James T. Kirk as the big E's 3rd captain, and Captain Spock as the big E's 4th. (Enterprise was destroyed before Kirk was reduced in rank back to Captain and given command of the NCC-1701-A)

Hope that this logic make sence.

Last edited by Pestalence_XC : 03-25-2008 at 05:04 PM.
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  #30  
Old 03-25-2008, 05:19 PM
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Works for me! Nicely done...
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