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Old 03-16-2008, 11:46 PM
Berengarius7 Berengarius7 is offline
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Default Why were TOS era ships tougher than those in later eras?

The TOS Enterprise could go toe to toe with a Klingon D-6 or a Romulan Warbird. While in DS9, the Dominion ships just vaporized Mirandas and tore the snot out of Galaxy, Nebula and Akira class ships like they were made out of paper or something. Am i the only one who didn't like that crap? It's like the Federation vessels were the most poorly designed ships in the universe. But during the TOS era, no such thing. The Enterprise was a tough customer and always gave as good as she took. Why in the world did DS9 and STNG make Federation vessels such panzies? At Least U.S.S. Voyager did kick a little *** some of the time! Say what you will about Janeway, but she was no wallflower. She wasn't one bit skittish about defending her ship and crew.
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:53 PM
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That's a good question! Well, as far as the DS9 is concerned, I think at one point Weyoun says that the Dominion has been in existence for 2000 yrs, I assume they've been an interstellar empire for that long, so they've been out there much longer than human and much longer than many other alpha quadrant races. Realistically you'd think they'd be so far ahead of the federation or other races it wouldn't be much of a fight, but I think the idea was that the Dominion were more advanced and larger, perhaps larger than more advanced, but regardless, they'd been out there far longer than humans, they were a much older civilization, space-faring anyway.

In TOS they dealt mostly with the Klingons or Romulans so maybe they were more evenly matched. I'm not sure about cannon here, I'm not sure how long humans have been in space compared to Vulcans, Klingons or Romulans but that would have something do with I would say.

Also budget, alot of DS9 and Voyager were all CGI so you could show alot of ships exploding without blowing up models you'd shoot every week as with TOS, which may have something to do with it as well.
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Old 03-17-2008, 12:13 AM
Berengarius7 Berengarius7 is offline
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It just frosts my cookies every time i'm watching a DS9 "Dominion War" episode and see a Federation starship get barely touched by some alien weapon and just go "poof!" like flash paper. Those ships are hundreds of feet long and took months and months for dockworkers to build and they're the arms of the Federation. If i was someone living on a planet bordering a neutral zone and saw something like that happen i'd be seriously concerned about Starfleet's ability to protect me.
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Old 03-17-2008, 12:20 AM
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No kidding! I hear you! I guess flashy explosions and ships being destroyed in one shot gets the ratings. I'd like to see trek space battles go back to the way they were in the first 6 movies. Huge ships that can take pounding after pounding after pounding. It gives them texture and realism.

Another point to add I think is that DS9 was the first time we saw fights of that magnitude, major fleet battles, to sell the point they may have had to show ships going up quickly to show one side was winning, one was losing. TNG had some fleet battles like Wolf359, but I preferred the way they showed that battle, the aftermath, quick cuts of Locutius/Picard controlling the borg cube. Showing the battles like they did in DS9, it's more interesting when you go to the characters the battle affects, rather than just showing a flashy battle, but to be fair DS9 did do both, I thought they kept the characters in the fight, but those federation ships, yes they went up like balsa wood! But it was a way of showing in a few shots that the Federation was losing.
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Old 03-17-2008, 02:46 AM
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Diffrent eras, diffrent power levels of weapons. But alot of those battles you mention in the TNG/DS9 were aginst enemies that were way more powerful, and had overall better weapons and tatics.
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Old 03-17-2008, 03:45 AM
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Maybe coz they built it in atmosphere using blowtorches instead of at utopia planetia... (like what they were doing in the teaser...)
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Old 03-17-2008, 04:41 AM
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LOL emlscs LOL
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Old 03-17-2008, 05:06 AM
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Berman.
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Old 03-17-2008, 05:14 AM
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Chris-

You cannot keep blaming everything you dislike about Trek on Berman, anymore that you can blame all the good or bad on Roddenberry.

It takes more than one person to make a show good, or bad.

Yeah, it's easy to point figners, but in the end, he didn't work alone. If you want to blame the "failure" of Trek on one thing, blame it on Paramount, where the blame really belongs. They let the franchise fall down. They had the power to staop these productions.
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Old 03-17-2008, 05:33 AM
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Actually in TOS the Enterprise was able to go toe-to-toe with up to three D-7 Battlecruisers with their disruptors and in THE DEADLY YEARS she was able to withstand the blows of at least three Romulan Bird of Prey starships with plasma weapons.
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