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  #1  
Old 03-19-2010, 01:13 PM
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Smile Who else thinks Star Trek II is the best Star Trek movie

I watched The Wrath of Khan and strange for a girl to admit I loved every single moment of the movie just a well balanced film don't you agree or do you have a differing opinion about it.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:49 PM
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Its more like who doesn't? Did you watch the Directors cut?
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Old 03-19-2010, 02:04 PM
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It's my favorite Trek film.
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Old 03-19-2010, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by MagaditH View Post
Its more like who doesn't? Did you watch the Directors cut?
I don't. I didn't think that the Director's Cut added anything beyond the Scotty-Preston relationship.

The Undiscovered Country is my favorite.
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Old 03-20-2010, 12:42 AM
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Yeah, it's generally my favourite of the films and I suppose that it also qualifies it as 'the best' I guess but while it is still I think the 'benchmark' Trek film I think that has both blessing and curse elements to it now so many years later.

At the time it was a relief after what I think most regarded as the very disappointing (in several ways) TMP and it's probably the only one of the TOS films to actually be able to balance the elements that made the series work so well when the series was on form.

You've got the adventure, the action, battles, humour and you have some human story depth to it. It doesn't really have a big moral lesson at play but it instead dwells deeply on elements of the humanity of the characters and that gives it some heft that maybe some of the other films lacked.

As ever, the best Trek involves the characters - and TWOK makes great use of them.

(Yes, it also has plot holes, silly science, contrivances of events and some interesting 'coincidences' along the way - so it also helped establish the films don't need to have watertight logical plots to work for audiences, something Meyer relied upon again with TUC).

The downside is that that very film template is something that by the 1990s when TNG started up it's film incarnation the makers of all the films were clearly indebted to aping in their films. They were trying to have the same balance of elements - which the TOS films subsequent to TWOK did not try to do, they were able to evolve in a seemingly more natural manner until Final Frontier kinda began the shift).

And yep, having all those elements in balance matters because it's pretty Trek to have them all in there.

The problem is that few of the films since have had a successful mix of those parts and often seem to be deliberately aping TWOK far too closely. Nemesis is, as far as I'm concerned, a pretty straightforward remake and even Abrams film can be regarded as a variation of TWOK in the Nero/Spock parts of the story - it's, as some have described it 'Spock's TWOK'.

So, yep, TWOK is the best of the films, but it unfortunately it's success and popularity since 1982 has had a legacy that I think has been detrimental to some of the later films.
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Old 03-20-2010, 01:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagaditH View Post
Its more like who doesn't? Did you watch the Directors cut?
For me, I think the DC actually takes a wee bit of shine from the film overall. The extended Peter Preston scences for instance; with Scotty's "crazy to get into space" comment was just a little cringeworthy IMHO. I didn't care for the alternate takes used in a few places either. I have to say I was extremely pleased the theatrical cut was chosen for the Blu-ray release last year.

The same applied to The Undiscovered Country - the theatrical cut sans the totally unnecessary and just a bit silly "scooby gang" ending - and at last - the original 2.35:1 aspect ratio for the first time on home video.

I actually would have loved to have TMP directors cut though, but as the new CG was rendered at 480 lines (doh) it made a Blu-ray release impossible.
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Old 03-20-2010, 01:14 AM
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I don't think I've ever seen the theatrical cut of TUC - I take it that was the version which had no Col. West and less conspiracy?

I saw the film first on VHS around 1992 and it had all those scenes back in.
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Old 03-20-2010, 02:33 AM
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Some of my friends were actually bored by WoK
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Old 03-20-2010, 02:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin View Post
I don't think I've ever seen the theatrical cut of TUC - I take it that was the version which had no Col. West and less conspiracy?

I saw the film first on VHS around 1992 and it had all those scenes back in.
Yes, that's spot on - no Colonel Odo... sorry, West!!! If you didn't catch TUC in theatres, the 2009 Blu-ray is actually the first time the original has been released on home video. All other versions have been the re-edit with the 2:1 reframing of the aspect ratio; which I always hated, but Nick Meyer actually stated he preferred. Personally, I love the original "scope" look.
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Old 03-20-2010, 02:51 AM
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No, I never saw it in theatres (I was a kid and the parents wouldn't take me!) - but I have often been curious about what the film looks like without those scenes.

I don't have Blu-Ray yet so will have to wait a bit longer to compare.

Although, since I'm so used to the 'conspiracy' version after almost twenty years I'm not sure I wouldn't feel a big chunk wasn't missing if I ever do catch it!
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