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  #31  
Old 02-24-2010, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janeway72 View Post
Which three episodes would you pick?
Sorry never saw this!

erm... this is difficult, am gonna pick episodes which don't use many trek clichés or generic plot themes, yet hopefully ones which give a broad view of what the show is about.

TNG: The Defector
Was really tempted to put down BOBW, but whilst an amazing episodes isn't a typical example of an episode. I wanted to show the intelligence that TNG displayed on occasion, other great examples are Inner Light and Darmok but I felt The Defector is very much TNG and Star Trek and doesn't just give it all to Picard.

DS9: Way of the Warrior
Was so tempting to put down Far Beyond the Stars or The Visitor but whilst amazing I don't feel their representative of DS9 overall. Way of the Warrior for me was almost like a second pilot for DS9, really sets a lot into motion and adds more depth to the show (amongst the great battle scenes).

VOY: Void
Really wanted to say Scorpion here as I think it's one of the best Voyager episodes. But I see Void as the series that Voyager should have been, the attrition of the crew in the face of dwindling resources, enemies on every side yet still holding onto their principals, forging alliances and exploring new life.
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  #32  
Old 02-24-2010, 09:37 PM
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Those were great choices. Although I don't remember which one Void was. (After trying to watch VOY during its UPN run and its WB re-runs, it finally took Jammer's review site to get me through most of the series when it ran on Spike several years back. Just because I would hit too many mediocre episodes otherwise, and give up).

I remember watching a re-run of 'The Defector' with some hallmates in our college lounge (I'm thinking this was back in '93), and being like "Dude! This is one of the best episodes EVER!!" However people were less than impressed with it, quickly pointing out all the cliched dialogue that was in the episode (as if to drive the point home, they were somehow able to anticipate the Romulan admiral's exact words spoken to Picard when he was finally about to convince Picard the preemptive strike was for real). When Picard asked Tamulak "Are you prepared to die today?", my friends were like "Oh, puh-lease!!" Then the Klingon warbirds decloaked, and suddenly everyone was agreeing how royally awesome the ep was. Go figure.

So I don't know. These were great shows... but I think they already haven't aged as well as we like to remember.
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  #33  
Old 02-25-2010, 09:56 AM
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Yeah, I went through a few season 1 TNG shows a couple weeks back and there's a definite aspect that some of the more mundane eps (even then) haven't got better over the years.
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  #35  
Old 02-25-2010, 10:10 AM
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To be fair 'Code of Honour' was embarrasing even in 1987!!
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Old 02-25-2010, 10:18 AM
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There's also 'Angel One' - which is hardly the feminist statement which may have been meant.

'Our computers are too sophisticated for a man to use' etc is pretty much just the diametric opposite of TOS's much observed sexism, but without actually saying anything useful along the way.
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  #38  
Old 02-25-2010, 12:48 PM
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A lot of TNG certainly has aged badly, I hated Code of Honour, was just a massive step backwards for what Star Trek was supposed to convey. Same with the episode where Tasha gives Wesley the 'drugs are bad' speech, was almost like they just inserted it in there to have a message.

The shows with a moral are always better when they just show us rather than tell us what's going on. The best example of this I think is 'Far beyond the stars', they never once use the word racism in that episode yet it was clear to everyone what the theme was about. I find that DS9 has aged a lot better.
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Old 02-25-2010, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by horatio View Post
I think they got a lot better in this respect in the later seasons, The Game or The Drumhead might be pretty direct but they don't feel forced.
I don't find anything wrong with directness, just when they bash you over the head with their message to the expense of integrating it into the story.

I think both the episodes you mentioned get their message across in an exciting way without diluting what they're trying to say (another star trek failing), examples of that could be 'Profit and Lace', where they vamp up the comedy so much that any real messages about feminism are lost. I still think Star Trek's best success of portraying feminism in any meaningful is in the success of Janeway's character.
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