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Old 05-30-2013, 07:14 AM
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Enterprise Captain Enterprise Captain is offline
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Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
It took him a year to plan. But the fact that he actually managed to get his people into the cryo tubes indicates that either he smuggled them there very slowly, one at a time, and absolutely no one checked the secure location they were being held in.
Which is highly unlikely in my opinion because like you said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
Given how clever he's meant to be, the security must have been pretty good
I agree and think that Admiral Marcus would keep the only bargaining chip he has with Khan under very tight lock and key. If it were me, I would have transport inhibitors, guards, security out the ying-yang, etc. I would also be doing a visual count of those tubes daily if not more frequently to make sure they aren't wondering off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
OR he managed to enact his plan in one swift motion. he got caught trying to smuggle his people away.
Much more likely but I don't see how Khan would think that moving 72 cryo tubes from a highly secure loction in to torpedoes would not get him caught?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
Basically:

Harrison is awoken by Marcus;

Marcus holds his people as hostages to force Harrison to work for him;

Harrison educates himself about 23rd century technology, and begrudgingly designs weapons and stuff for Marcus;

Secretly, Harrison plots to sneak his people away;

This plot includes designing a torpedo with a casing that would be perfect for smuggling the cryo tubes away undetected;

Harrison risks discovery by enacting the first part of the plan;

Harrison is discovered, and is led to believe that Marcus has killed his people, but manages to escape and evade Section 31's clutches;

Marcus remains silent about the escape of this dangerous man, as this operation is top secret and involves illegal weapons and possible warmongering;

Harrison wreaks revenge by exploiting his knowledge of the workforce of Section 31 to force Mickey Smith's great-great-great-grandson to blow up the weapons development facility that he worked at;

Marcus goes public with the knowledge of "John Harrison", but lies about what really happened;

Harrison attempts to kill Marcus and cripple Starfleet, killing Captain Pike;

James T Kirk offers to take revenge on Harrison, Marcus uses this blind rage to his advantage and gives Kirk the torpedoes in the hope that Kirk will be rash and simply fire them, and that the explosion from the propulsion fuel of 72 torpedoes would be enough to kill Harrison and destroy any traceable evidence of Khan's people;

(He also ensures that the Enterprise is crippled in Klingon space, so that they would definitely be caught, and war would start);

James T Kirk listens to his friends;

Sulu informs Harrison that they have 72 torpedoes aimed at him;

Harrison surrenders, realising that Marcus had deceived him.
A good summary of the events that follow and I agree with you that everything from the point after Khan's intial attack seems to fall in place pretty well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
I'd like to know that as well, but that would have slowed the story down.
Sorry but you're making excuses for lazy writing here. Khan's motive is important and it could have been explained with out slowing down the story. Khan's intial plan to smuggle his crew out in those torpedos is pretty stupid if you ask me. After going threw this disscusion with you I think it would have made more sense had Admiral Marcus been the one to put Khan's crew into those torpedos with out Khan's knowledge as a way to get rid of them. Then have Khan find out about Admiral Marcus' plan and the rest of the film could have played out as it did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
They could put that into a tie-in comic.
Sorry but I don't care about the comics and again that's an excuse for something that could have been simply explained in the film.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA-1842 View Post
They think there is an active warhead in there at first because the device says it's active. The shielding prevented them from knowing what was inside.

When they were beamed to the Vengeance, the cryo tubes had been removed and replaced with warheads from the Enterprise's own arsenalc
That's an assumption and never clearly stated. Kirk assumed when the torpedoes went off on the Vengeance that Spock just killed the 72 people in those torpedoes. If the only way to set them off was to replace the cyro tubes with warheads why did Kirk make that assumption?

Last edited by Enterprise Captain : 05-30-2013 at 09:52 AM.
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