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Old 05-23-2009, 10:23 AM
NC Trekker NC Trekker is offline
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Default Should Spock Prime share future knowledge?

The "Supreme Court" should dispense with the “Temporal Prime Directive” idea and say that Spock Prime shares his knowledge of the future with Starfleet. It made sense to have a rule against that when the timeline was linear and time travel affected the one true timestream. Now that time travel creates alternate realities, there is no need for it. There is no such thing as protecting the integrity of future events and thus no need for such a rule. The interpretation of time travel that makes the movie possible does away with the need for a “temporal prime directive.”

To use another example, Spock Prime already intervened to save Earth once in the movie. Is he just going to sit around and allow Vger to convert the planet into data patterns, allow the whale probe to do its thing, or not warn about the Borg? Of course not. He is going to tell what he knows, that includes details on probably hundreds of planets and races, threats such as the those shown above, the existence of Trelane, the Oragnians, and Q, plus lots more. The good thing is that he doesn’t need to write it out, he can just mind meld to pass along the info.

This opens up a lot of story potential. In the Q&A on trekmovie.com, Robert Orci hinted that Spock Prime influenced Kirk’s promotion to captain of the Enterprise at the end of the movie. That, along with his work on the Vulcan colony world, means Spock Prime revealed himself to Starfleet. Do you think Starfleet is just going to allow this tremendous source of information to keep it all to himself? It would give the Federation a tremendous advantage over its rivals and change the balance of power in all kinds of interesting ways. It is something worth pursuing, even though the focus of the next movie is obviously going to be on the young crew. This would provide a means to avoid repeating stories and adventures from the prime universe. Seeing as Starfleet already knows to deal with most of those situations there would be no need to even show them. For example, you could say that Starfleet sent some other starship out to deal with Vger thanks to the warning by Spock Prime. That would free up the Enterprise crew for a series of movies about fresh new adventures.

My advice is to forget about the Temporal Prime Directive. That is “linear time thinking” in a parallel reality. Saying that Spock Prime shared knowledge allows for more creative use of the existing elements of the alternate reality, rather than repeating stories of the past.

Given Spock Primes knowledge, the new crew will not have to rediscover the mysteries of the galaxy that the prime crew already dealt with. It frees them for new things.

What does everyone think?
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:34 AM
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Vincent Cain Vincent Cain is offline
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I think Spock Prime has shared enough; what he needed to share to get Kirk in that Captain's chair.
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:47 AM
Kiko Kea Kiko Kea is offline
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As long as he did not share information about what happened to people in the other timeline, I think he could safely and ethically share technical knowledge and his understanding of relations between the various worlds.

Doesn't he say at the end of the movie he's going to dedicate his life to preserving the knowledge he has? CAn't remember if that's the movie or the book.
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:12 AM
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Yagami Crewman Yagami Crewman is offline
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Obviously certain threats like the Borg or V'ger are constants and Spock would be remiss in keeping silent.

Other threats are more vague and may or may not take place in a shifting timeline.

The Klingons... Praxis is still on course to explode. What does Spock do? If the Klingons somehow become allies then telling them that Praxis is prepped to go boom would be a point of honor. If they are still adversaries, does Spock warn them and try to earn their goodwill? This might fall short of the original historical agreements. Or would the Klingons even listen? Or does he keep silent and the Empire might figure out he knew and consider his silence dishonorable and treacherous?

Technical developments. While he wants the Federation prepared, I think it would be too dangerous to giveaway too much tech. It would be easy for the Federation's neighbors to become alarmed if the Feds suddenly leap ahead in tech. This would be dangerous. Also it would affect companies and many other things. Then again, taking a guiding hand on some individuals. (Like Richard Daystrom) might not be a bad idea. Certainly do not expect the M-5 Wargames disaster to repeat.

Spock is in a very grey area... But then Command is all about those grey areas and in that, Spock has seen the best in action.
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:44 AM
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Spock already upgraded Scotty's tech knowledge a leap or two to get Scotty and Kirk back aboard the Enterprise at warp. It's that old Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home Idea when Scotty gave that industrial mogul the formula for transparent aluminum. "Somebody had to invent the thing!". The problem with that little glitch, is that that industrial mogul didn't invent that technology, it was given to him. That kind of thing definitely qualifies as a violation of the temporal prime directive.
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:06 PM
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Spock prime should share knowledge, for two good reasons:

1. The Borg
2. It'd fit the story for Nero to have probably shared his with the Klingons
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Last edited by SouthernSpockette : 05-23-2009 at 12:10 PM. Reason: #2
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:25 PM
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Yagami Crewman Yagami Crewman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernSpockette View Post
Spock prime should share knowledge, for two good reasons:

1. The Borg
2. It'd fit the story for Nero to have probably shared his with the Klingons
Number 2 is not really that likely. He blew away 47 Klingon ships and if he wants to make Romulus "safe" then he knows that after the Federation, the Klingons are another threat to his people. Barring the novelization, we don't know the specifics of his capture but obvious the Klingons didn't get the Naranda. Possibly Nero tried to use Robau's shuttle from the Kelvin on some sort of reconnaisance mission when he was captured leaving his crew to find him. It is unlikely the Klingons had any real sense of the Naranda's power and technology before their ships started falling like clay pigeons.
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Old 05-23-2009, 07:12 PM
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SouthernSpockette SouthernSpockette is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yagami Crewman View Post
Number 2 is not really that likely. He blew away 47 Klingon ships and if he wants to make Romulus "safe" then he knows that after the Federation, the Klingons are another threat to his people. Barring the novelization, we don't know the specifics of his capture but obvious the Klingons didn't get the Naranda. Possibly Nero tried to use Robau's shuttle from the Kelvin on some sort of reconnaisance mission when he was captured leaving his crew to find him. It is unlikely the Klingons had any real sense of the Naranda's power and technology before their ships started falling like clay pigeons.
Unfortunately, I didn't read Countdown (still plan to), but think about this: What better a bargaining chip, than to make nice with the Klingons by sharing more advanced technology promised to give their cherished empire a major advantage over the Federation? Hence, you have a major problem the Federation would need to "nip in the bud". Don't forget, in the movie Nero mentioned a desire to see Romulus being free of Federation influence. That being the case, why wouldn't have have somehow managed to communicate these advances to them for the same purpose--to give them a technological advantage? In any case, I think the next movie should definitely include Spock Prime's having shared his knowledge so as to ward off trouble from some not-so-neighborly adversaries.
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:18 PM
Kiko Kea Kiko Kea is offline
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Perhaps Spock will find himself giving 'guidance' in many instances, as opposed to outright gifts of technical knowledge or specific warnings.
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Old 05-23-2009, 01:02 PM
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For #1 all he would have to do is vaguely warn that there are powerful empires or whatever and the feds better be ready for them. But maybe after all of this he didnt feel the need to. After all, nothing would speak louder to that than the destruction of a planet.. and the possible destruction of another.
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