The Official Star Trek Movie Forum

The Official Star Trek Movie Forum (http://www.startrekmovie.com/forums/index.php)
-   Voyager (http://www.startrekmovie.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=15)
-   -   Did SEVEN Ever Become a Person? (http://www.startrekmovie.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9852)

chator 10-22-2009 11:27 AM

Did SEVEN Ever Become a Person?
 
At times, i think, the way Jeri Ryan played her, that Seven was always a drone, even when she didn't look like one. Also, in contrasting her to other characters that sought to become more human like Data on TNG, or The Doctor on Voyager, i think she was the least human. What do you guys think? Did she even strike you as a real person with passions, interests, hobbies, desires of her own? Or a drone in a human body?

Captain Tom Coughlin 10-22-2009 11:29 AM

I believe she already was a person, just a quirky one. I think if you could see 20 years into the future she would have been even more "assimilated" into human culture.

horatio 10-22-2009 11:38 AM

She definitely became more human over the run of the show, but I think that the human journeys of Spock, Data, Odo, the Doctor or T'Pol were more interesting. Albeit much shorter (Family and First Contact), Picard's de-assimilation story was also better. It was never even hinted that being a Borg traumatized Seven and left scars on her soul.

janeway72 10-22-2009 02:57 PM

Seven did grow more human over seasons 4-7. She did seem to blend into the crew way too quickly and although she had difficulty understanding humans sometimes, it was similar to the kind of difficulty Tuvok had and that was from having suppressed his emotions. I agree with Horatio, in that the damage to her soul from being assimilated at the age of 6 was not explored.

jla1987 10-22-2009 03:53 PM

She's definitely the least interesting when it comes to alien human journeys. Great to look at, but nothing hadn't been done better before story-wise.

Captain Tom Coughlin 10-22-2009 03:55 PM

I like her, and I like the way she challenges Janeway.

jla1987 10-22-2009 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Tom Coughlin (Post 271800)
I like her, and I like the way she challenges Janeway.

It's tough for me, because she's interesting and yet she's on Voyager, which IMO just rehashed plotlines over & over. It's probably the most hit & miss series of the ones I've seen. There are some real gems and each character has plenty of great moments (yes, even Neelix), but toward the end it was basically the Borg show.

HippyDave 12-01-2009 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jla1987 (Post 271797)
She's definitely the least interesting when it comes to alien human journeys. Great to look at, but nothing hadn't been done better before story-wise.

I beg to disagree - I think in many ways she's the most successful example of a being (re)discovering their humanity, with the exception of Spock. I enjoyed Data's steady discovery of what it means to be human, but as Data put it himself, it took the emotion chip to nudge him over the precipice and allow him to make those emotional connections that he was otherwise unable to do. Consequently, I don't think Data's humanising arc was as dramatic until very near the end.

Seven's 'scars' from her experience as part of the collective are dealt with several times, but my favourite moment in dealing with the Borg was always Dark Frontier, where she is forced to watch/listen as a race is attacked and assimilated... until she can't bear it any more and forces herself to interfere. Those few scenes alone say a great deal about her own emotional scars and her recovering humanity. Also, remember that she was assimilated very young, and wasn't in the same kind of career/position that Picard was in when he was turned into Locutus. Small wonder Picard consequently suffered from such self-recrimination and hated the Borg so much - because he felt so responsible for their actions. Seven didn't have to deal with anything as onerous.

My favourite 'discovering what it means to be human' arcs have always been those portrayed by Seven, Spock & Odo.

Zardoz 12-01-2009 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HippyDave (Post 285927)
I beg to disagree - I think in many ways she's the most successful example of a being (re)discovering their humanity, with the exception of Spock. I enjoyed Data's steady discovery of what it means to be human, but as Data put it himself, it took the emotion chip to nudge him over the precipice and allow him to make those emotional connections that he was otherwise unable to do. Consequently, I don't think Data's humanising arc was as dramatic until very near the end.

Seven's 'scars' from her experience as part of the collective are dealt with several times, but my favourite moment in dealing with the Borg was always Dark Frontier, where she is forced to watch/listen as a race is attacked and assimilated... until she can't bear it any more and forces herself to interfere. Those few scenes alone say a great deal about her own emotional scars and her recovering humanity. Also, remember that she was assimilated very young, and wasn't in the same kind of career/position that Picard was in when he was turned into Locutus. Small wonder Picard consequently suffered from such self-recrimination and hated the Borg so much - because he felt so responsible for their actions. Seven didn't have to deal with anything as onerous.

My favourite 'discovering what it means to be human' arcs have always been those portrayed by Seven, Spock & Odo.

Overall I agree with you, but due to the way they dressed the charater, it cheapened the message, and good perfomances by Ms. Ryan. It's hard to belive a charater when they are all trussed up in a "Bunny suit."

I know sexuality sells, and that was the reason, just like Troi on TNG. But DS9 had great female charaters and they NEVER had to "dress sexy" during working hours.

horatio 12-01-2009 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HippyDave (Post 285927)
Also, remember that she was assimilated very young, and wasn't in the same kind of career/position that Picard was in when he was turned into Locutus. Small wonder Picard consequently suffered from such self-recrimination and hated the Borg so much - because he felt so responsible for their actions. Seven didn't have to deal with anything as onerous.

Most of the Seven stuff, although well-played and on average mediocrely-written, felt lukewarm and tedious to me, perhaps because it wasn't new territory:

Picard's scenes in 'Family' and 'First Contact' are much more powerful (and shorter) than all the Seven episodes ... and Hugh's story of becoming an invidual was much more to the point.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:56 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2009 by Paramount Pictures. STAR TREK and all related
marks and logos are trademarks of CBS Studios Inc. All Rights Reserved.